Hmm that is quite interesting, greenfield have always used the collar, right up until the last fastcut. My red one is the same, however i did just pull up the photo of the #2 machine and it appears to use nuts! Doesn't really mean much, still, indicates how early it is though i guess.
Wheel nuts are standard on the early rovers if that means much, i know theo worked for rover before greenfield, maybe he wanted to separate the machines a bit further.
That’s very interesting! I’ve not seen or heard of nuts to retain the front wheel before. I just tried to zoom in on the photos of Lewis’ machine but I’m unable to determine. It could very well be an historical indicator. I’m seriously up for the view that it is factory. It’s the kind of thing you might do in the early days of production which would be reconsidered later down track from the point of view of production cost- especially if the collars are available off the shelf.
Many thanks for this potential insight!
Can we have photos please?
Greenfielder, can you shed some insight on this?
Cheers,
EDIT: just pulled up photos of greenfielder’s machine. It”s bit blurry but it appears to have nuts!
Will try to post photos but this new iPad really hates sending photos to the forum
Ok, brief history lesson greenfield was started by Theo Reinhold in 64-65, first hd8 produced in 1966. Somewhere along the line Theo's son Lewis took over the family business. A couple of years ago he stumbled across this forum and was very forthcoming with info from the early days, what he could remember as he was on a kid in the early days. Here is a link to the thread. https://www.outdoorking-forum.com.au/forum/ubbthreads.php/topics/89452/a-question-for-lewis.html
He went quiet after about a month or so, and hasnt been back here since. With you're company going into liquidation i suspect it would have been a hectic and stressful time for him, not much time for us fanatics 😂
Ok got the better of me, and i went and took the wheel off and took some pics, the last couple are my Dads machine with the odd wheels sitting on there with the towel rail that will work as a shim for them
I cant work out if its factory or a Mod, its a very good Mod if that what it is
I can confirm that my early red does have nuts, they probably went to the shaft collar system after Theo got sick of the nuts working themselves loose?
Thanks for confirming this. I reckon you might be right greenfielder. The nut looks like just a plain nut- not nyloc etc. the nut would need to be staked ?
Fxxxrr, So dads retrofit front wheels have too large a diameter onto the axle?
Thanks for confirming this. I reckon you might be right greenfielder. The nut looks like just a plain nut- not nyloc etc. the nut would need to be staked ?
Fxxxrr, So dads retrofit front wheels have too large a diameter onto the axle?
Cheers,
Yes Thanks Greenfielder for confirming this, and yes its a plain nut not a nyloc, it presumably is set up so that the sleeve and bearing centres can be clamped tightly by the nut and hopefully allow the bearing mounted wheel to spin without putting any loosening force on the nut.
And yes PRD the "trolly" wheels i have are to big a diameter inner for the axles however a sleeve of that towel rail is almost exactly what it needs to make it all work, however the wheel hub width is the same as the length of the axle, so i have no excess to attach the collar to, so im yet to think of a solution for that those trolley wheels were just something i had, i pulled them off an old billy cart the kids had, which has been behind my shed in the no use to me any more but dont want to get rid of pile, I originally was hoping that they tyres may have fitted the rims, but they are 4 inch and as you know i need 6 inch tyres.
I will most likely run the wheels from the early one on Dads machine for now, as hopefully the nut will work on the trolly wheels letting me use the collar on Dads. My aim today is to fire dads up, I need to get the new carb and get the early on fired up before i can swap them over and start stripping dads down , damn Aust post for being slow LOL
Ok so the new machine as i have started calling it, is Alive, The new carby arrived today, and i fitted it up, after finding metric screws to attach it with, as the old ones were imp. roughly set the mixture screws etc, made a new fuel bowl gasket to fix that leak, and Lo and Behold it starts and runs, albeit only with the choke on, but it runs, roughly but it runs, oh and its smoking from the centrifugal clutch, oh the shut of switch doesn't shut it off, luckily the choke does LOL quick check and then i remember that the large drive pulleys were seized and didnt turn, few squirts of magic juice onto the bearings couple of taps with a rubber mallet and hey presto they turn, fire it back up again and all is good, except an almost drive off on it own bias towards the pedal being in the forward position, Pull off the other half of the transmission cover and discover 2 spring of horribly different proportions , out with the spring box, dig around and nothing suitable, so bend up a couple of compression springs to suit. fire it up again and success, a reasonably central neutral position a centrifugal clutch that works drive pulleys that work, a motor that runs, if i had a seat on it i could almost do a lap... have a bit of a fiddle with the mixture screw only to make it temperamental to start and the pull starter is only engaging every 28 pulls, so with my back screaming at me in pain, i decide that the day was a success and i need a coffee, i will grab a few pics a bit later on when the endone has kicked in
Thats great news, the drive bearings on those early greenfields have a tough life and are often never maintained due to how hard it is to get them off, they are always worth a look on any new project.
Thats great news, the drive bearings on those early greenfields have a tough life and are often never maintained due to how hard it is to get them off, they are always worth a look on any new project.
Cheers Greenfielder
Cheers Greenfielder. its far from a project, its a model 1 i picked up almost by accident the other day, i got it for parts for my own early, that was my Dads.but have since realised nt much will fit, and its to rare to part out. so im simply just having a little fun seeing if i can get it running.
My dads machine is the one that will become the project
The engine only running on choke should just be tuning, though they did have some problems with the intake gaskets, particularly the top one.
For tuning the little one on the upper of the carb is your low speed, the one out the bottom on an angle is the high speed. 1.5 turns is the normal starting point.
I am keen to see what springs are on the drive as greenfield never used any to make the pedal go neutral. There should be 2 small springs internally in the drive but that is all. Usually what happens is people grease the drive shaft where the clutches slide, it gets gritty/sticky and won't neutralise.
Nothing quite beats the satisfaction of a first start! Doesn’t seem to matter what type of machine, the feeling is always the same- perhaps feels best the older the machine and the longer it has sat without being run.
Yup, as Nath says it sounds like something funky has been done with the drive system. But sorting that sort of thing out is just part of the fun!
yea tuning is definitely needed, i started with holden red motor standard setting of 1/2 turn out LOL
ok wasnt aware of no springs there was some dodgy ones there but as i said uneven, im not sure what happens if i leave the springs off LOL i just assumed it should have some, cos there was some there, took me 40 mins to bend these up and adjust them to get a nice neutral position heres a pic of what i have come up with
My old red has evidence of having two springs as well, Having not driven one with this setup I cant comment from experience but I feel that having the springs there would cause strain on your ankle - from fighting against spring pressure. Although it probably did aid the primitive mechanisms return-to-center ability.
It would probably work just fine without the springs but you obviously put a lot of effort into making some so it would be a shame to remove them
That spring arrangement is not one I’ve seen before. But it works! Truth be known if they are needed then something is v wrong with
the drive. Might just be gummed up as Nath says. But it an ingenious solution to the problem!- at least in the short term.
I just had a rummage in the shed. I thought I might be able to help you out with your wheel problem but the ones I was thinking of will have the same problem- too wide and no room for the collar. Sorry
I’m just wondering.......if yours, greenfielder has evidence of springs at the very same location. Was this factory???.......i.e. pre-dates the internal springs? I’m just wondering......
I feel that the springs may be a factory design, the set-up is too similar between Fxxxrr's machine and mine to be a coincidence. I do agree with you though, another overbuilt greenfield design, the drive system should work just fine without it.
That spring arrangement is not one I’ve seen before. But it works! Truth be known if they are needed then something is v wrong with
the drive. Might just be gummed up as Nath says. But it an ingenious solution to the problem!- at least in the short term.
I just had a rummage in the shed. I thought I might be able to help you out with your wheel problem but the ones I was thinking of will have the same problem- too wide and no room for the collar. Sorry
Cheers,
Cheers Guys both for having a rummage for wheels and input on the springs,
I have rims its just tyres and tubes im short LOL
It may work fine without the springs, it had a bias when i got it because of different size springs creating it, Once i get it all tuned up i will try it with and without the springs and see how it goes, As i mentioned earlier this one is just a bit of a play thing at present, I just wanted to get it running so i could at least do a few laps of the yard and perhaps a blockie LOL I never intended to start resto on my Dads one right now, as i have so many other things on the go including being half way through restoring an EH panel Van. now that its dug out i might set it up in an area out of the way, and that can be my something to do when i dont know what to do project LOL The earlier one, i will probably end up moving on once i have had my fun with it . it might donate some tyres though LOL
I feel that the springs may be a factory design, the set-up is too similar between Fxxxrr's machine and mine to be a coincidence. I do agree with you though, another overbuilt greenfield design, the drive system should work just fine without it.
Cheers Greenfielder
Interesting, I shaped my springs based on one of the ones that was already there, it fitted in a way that made me think it was original so perhaps if they were factory one of mine was still original, i think i know what you mean by internal springs, my drive discs seem to move very freely from side to side and appear to have no spring pressure to return them to centre if the external springs aren't there
This could be interesting...... I’d be interested to see greenfielders spring arrangement. We might be on to something here.
EH panelvan! Now we’re talkin’ !!
LOL an Ex Ambulance EH panelvan all original inside still , well the back, im missing original front seats, still have lights sirens etc for it partway through paint and panel now but i been laid up since june with this bloody back so no progress since then
I to would like to see Greenfields evidence of springs
The EH sounds absolutely brilliant!! Where did you find such an original machine??
It came from Sth Aust originally, was a St johns Country car, I got it from the gold coast from the guy who had shipped it up here, was just luck that i got it, as it wasn't advertised as an Ambulance, it was only when i rang up about it that he mentioned it
I dont know if it would be inappropriate to post a few pics up here for you??
but here's a little teaser, sorry for those that think its inappropriate
I have a devious plan to solve my wheel issue temporarily,
the hub of the trolley wheels is essentially a tube with a bearing each end, my plan is to shorten said tube to allow either a collar or nut to go onto the end of the axle to retain the wheel, ive got 3 sets of wheel to play with, so have a little margin for error LOL
The wheel fix didnt work and was doomed to failure right from the word go, The centre hub is of course machine at each end to accept the bearing, it has a shoulder which it reats agaianst to stop it going further in. this would have been fine if i has a lathe, unfortunately i dont. So i had to come up with a plan B. what started as taking a second set of wheel apart to see how the hub on them was made, resulted in the realisation that the hubs were totally different, Long story short, by mixing up habs and wheel halves i was able to come up with a wheel that had a different offset and had a narrow enough hub to work with the existing axle, this will allow the Mk1 machine to stay mobile while i play with Dads machine.
I also tweaked the Carb today so now it idles nicely at a speed below which the centrifugal; clutch wants to kick in, but it also revs well, the foot pedal sits an a totally different angle to the left one though, and this hampered my attempt at a hot lap, as my "F" ed up leg and back dont work at those angles, unfortunately the back won today and i had to retreat to the comfort of painkillers before i could see if there is a way to adjust the neutral resting position. My temp seat of a few bits of wood and a cushion probably didnt help LOL
Sounds like you’re innovation in solving the wheel problem is something your old man would be proud of! 10 points!
Now, the seat problem. I can help you with that. I’ve collected a few seats and seat springs from tractor model machines. They are pretty much identical to the one that would have been on that machine originally. My shout.
Sounds like you’re innovation in solving the wheel problem is something your old man would be proud of! 10 points!
Now, the seat problem. I can help you with that. I’ve collected a few seats and seat springs from tractor model machines. They are pretty much identical to the one that would have been on that machine originally. My shout.
Cheers,
LOL i do like a good tinker and problem solve when it comes to shed stuff, In some respects its more fun to try to figure out a way to do it for free, rather than buy something to do the job LOL in this instance all i need to do is buy a couple of tyres and tubes, however that would be no fun LOL i accepted defeat with the carby as i know i had no chance of delicately extracting the damaged tube. wait till you see my exhaust Hack LOL a good rummage through a scrap bin at an exhaust shop yesterday wielded hopefully enough stuff to make makeshift exhaust for either machine if not both, The muffler on the Mk1 machine is barely in 1 piece, and is rather loud, so should decide to keep it it will need something, so i have obtained a smallish car muffler which should quieten it down a lot, For Dads machine i have a rather industrial looking resonator LOL essentially an expansion tube, but will look rather aggressive sticking up like a real tractor. Im flattered by the seat offer, I need to have a look at the neutral setting on the pedal first, cos if i cant sort that then i will have no chance of using it so no point keeping it, and it would be rather unfair of me to accept a seat only to move it on with the unit itself. although i have thought of adding some separate foot pegs and a lever off the pedal to allow hand operation, My mind sometimes works at a far faster rate than my body will allow me to accomplish maybe i can pay for the seat in stories about my Panelvan LOL ( i do have another old holden and a vintage tear drop camper as well)
Some stories about the EH and the camper for the seat sounds like an excellent swap!
I’m trying to imagine an EH ambulance getting down the highway with a teardrop camper in tow! What a brilliant sight that would be.
The pedal thing should be very fixable. A couple of thoughts.
If the pedal has too much travel then the corks may need replacing and/or the pulley bearings.
If the problem is just the at rest position of the pedal then a few things could contributing:
The transmission pulley stack needs to be centred with reference to the transmission drive fork pivot. In one of your photos is looks like it may not be centred - but it’s had to tell in the photo. The whole assembly (including the shaft) can be slid on the mount bearings and is then locked in place with collars similar to the ones that hold the wheels on your dads machine- assuming it’s the same as my later machine. In fact if these collars aren’t locked tight the shaft might be sliding in the bearings and this would increase the pedal travel.
The rod from the pedal to the drive fork link is adjustable. Lengthen or shorten to alter the pedal position.
I noticed in one of the photos that you took of the springs that this rod on your machine has a significant bend in it. The older machines don’t have this bend and I’m guessing (?) it shouldn’t be there. If it were straightened this will alter the pedal position heaps?
