OutdoorKing Repair Forum Forums Repairs and Maintenance Questions On Ride On Mowers Questions on Greenfield Ride On Mower Frames Re: Greenfield Ride-On - Electrical Wiring

The voltage you measure with that test is the battery voltage, not the charging capability of the alternator. Hence all you have shown is that your new battery has not completed its plate-formation process yet, and it won't achieve higher voltages until it has. The only thing you know about your alternator is that it is putting out enough charge to raise the voltage across your battery by 0.3 Volts. From memory, it is a 3 Amp alternator.

I would be very surprised if your engine has a voltage regulator for a tiny alternator like that. All it will do, is put its puny 3 Amps into the battery when it is running flat out, and proportionally less at other times. 3 Amps will not hurt a battery that size, even if it is fully charged already.

On another subject, those mesh screens in front of your headlights will be costing you about 25% of your light output. I don't understand why you used them. They won't protect anything against bumping into solid objects, and I doubt your ride on mower will encounter many small stones thrown up by vehicles at highway speeds.

Cheers, nicely explained, so running headlights should be ok with that amount of charge going in to the battery. I was thinking the battery would drain faster than it could recharge!

The reason the wire mesh is in front of the lights is for two reasons, well three reasons really

It was already in place and I had just painted it as it was rusty,,,

Also, the new lights are a different shape to the holes already in the bonnet as I could not get original items. So to make these lights a snug fit I would have to trim metal off of each side of the headlight hole and weld a strip along the top and bottom of each hole and make the bracket to mount them so the lenses are just protruding through, with a rubber trim around the opening and obviously paint the front of the bonnet. I like the "simple is efficient" rule!

As for stones flying up, when it is on a trailer on the back of my van going to and from jobs, yes it is quite possible, which is why I left them as a type of stone guard, I live on a small island, 26 miles long, and approx. 13 miles wide, (146 sq miles) and our roads are horrendous

It doesn't have one, as was determined earlier in this thread, from the Briggs Repair Manual:

The 'charging diode' in the harness is only there for the hour meter; i.e. so that the meter will only run while the engine is running, and generating power.


Yep, with such a low DC output, it is easy for lights to exceed that, and draw the battery down.
Hence grumpy's [and my] attraction to the much more efficient LED lights, which also draw much less current [<0.3A, or 3.6W, each].
If your lights use standard automotive globes, it is quite easy to get 'LED globe' plugin replacements, and this would be a good way to go.

Just as an example, this mob in the US have a good variety, including some that are OK with 12V AC; https://www.superbrightleds.com/cat/tail-brake-turn/

First, good point about the trailer-work, Iceman, I hadn't thought of that, and as an ex-caravaner, I agree, it would be a problem without stone guards.

Second, on the subject of whether your alternator can keep up with your headlights so your battery is not discharging when you run the lights, we need more information to resolve it. What is the wattage of the globes you have in those lights? Let's say they are ordinary car turn-signal globes, which are usually 18 Watts each I think, but may be a bit more in some cases. Two 18 Watt globes is a total of 36 Watts power consumption. 36 Watts divided by 12 Volts is 3 Amps consumption. Your alternator has to be cranking out 3 Amps to just break even on maintaining the battery's charge. However, you only get 3 Amps when the engine is running full scream, so realistically, you will be losing ground on battery charge any time you run a pair of 18 Watt globes. See why I recommended using the AC line? You'll get dim headlights, but the battery will actually be charging all the time, not discharging slightly.

I think that mower, like most, was designed to use DC for the lights because it was expected to only have the lights on occasionally for short periods, so the battery could recharge the rest of the time, when the lights were not on. Briggs provided the AC output as well, to cater for people who wanted to use the lights a lot.

Going from an expense point of view, I would have thought it would have been easier/cheaper to run a wire from the ignition switch to the hour meter, rather than have extra wires, a wire harness, and charging diode in place! More to go wrong! But I guess no risk of the hours going up if you accidently leave the ignition switched on!




The standard bulbs in the new lights came at 21w. I have got a pair of LED bulbs for it (equivalent to 21w) but testing them in my van rear lights they are dim dim dim, so I think I was sold some dud ones!!

You bought a pair of 21 Watt LED bulbs? You are definitely planning to melt the bushes. A couple of points, though. First, are they rated for AC as well as DC, or only for DC? Second, remember that they use the same amount of power as the original incandescent bulbs that were in those lights, they just produce ten times more light when they do it.

Did you get the correct type of bulb base? There are twin filament bases, with two solder terminals on the end of the base and either symmetrical or offset pins for the bayonet base, similar-looking single filament bases with two solder terminals but only one of them connected, and single filament bases with one central solder terminal and symmetrical pins for the bayonet base. If you have bought single filament bulbs with twin solder contacts, you may not have been applying power to the right contact. If you were forcing a symmetrical-pin single contact bulb into an offset-pin twin contact socket, anything could happen.

That plastic fitting on your engine looks like the mounting for a voltage regulator. Since you did not get a large, regulated alternator, nobody installed a regulator in the mounting.

Mmm, he could just mean that they were sold as 'equivalent to 21W', i.e. claimed similar light output to a 21W conventional incandescent bulb. More likely, I'd reckon, particularly if a FleaBay seller.

+1 on the correct bulb base info, of course.

As an aside, I'm rather impressed with the light output of some of the multi-SMD LED festoon 'bulbs' now made to replace car interior lighting bulbs. The better bayonet cap ones should be good too.

I haven't tried any automotive LED lights yet, mainly because to replace the bulbs in most of my lights you have to dismantle half the car. For example, to replace a parking light or front turn signal bulb you have to begin by removing the front bumper. I think the rear lights are about as difficult. The joys of modern cars.

I remember the old days, when one morning I noticed a parking light was out on my car, replaced the bulb in the time it took to get one from the shed, then went to work and left the parking lights on all day. If I hadn't replaced that bulb I'd have been able to use the starter, but adding the load of that fourth bulb meant I had to push. Luckily, cars of that era were very easy to push start single-handed.

Ah yes, i have the correct fitment and the LED bulbs were listed on eBay as "equivalent to 21w".

Been too wet to wire it up, but as my two mowers do not have any form of ignition lights or "idiot lights" as they are known here, I decided to buy one of these




Quite handy on old bikes and in old cars, and will hopefully show me if all is well with my charging and the battery too.

So that will fill my third hole on the "dashboard" of the Greenfield.

Not so! I found today that if it is removed then no charge goes to the battery!

Finally got around to wiring in the lights, severe wet weather lately and no time to play!

So, first photo, lights on tickover, running off the AC supply.

Second photo on 3/4 throttle running off the AC supply.

Third photo, still at 3/4 throttle I flicked over to the DC supply from the factory fitted wire on the back of the ignition switch.

Fourth photo, There were already 3 holes in the metal body (dashboard) under the sticker, these holes had punched through the thin sticker sheet so I thought I would make use of them, two switches (lights and horn as I may be going road legal next year) I fitted an LED warning light http://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/321561833001?_trksid=p2059210.m2749.l2649&ssPageName=STRK%3AMEBIDX%3AIT to show charging status, red on tickover and very low revs.

Fifth photo, LED changes to green when revs rise above 1/4 throttle. This LED has a battery checker in it to show flat battery, overcharging etc.

Sixth photo, a little sticker I had made up, this is where it was originally sold.

Great thread fella's, it has been very illuminating

Iceman, I love seeing an Aussie mower over in the UK.

Before this thread, I was never aware that you could have AC and DC supplies from a ride on engine and you have shown the difference in great detail. Love the charging light.

Thanks to all.

How far do you have to have the speed control advanced from idle to have your light go green when the headlights are on?

That's a bit weird. The only reason I can see to have a diode in the mower harness is as a blocking diode, to prevent the battery running the hour meter. The diode on the engine side of the plug is already performing the rectifier function.
Unless there's more than two terminals in the diode plug, and it has more than one circuit?

That wiring diagram isn't really clear enough to be a good circuit diagram, so I had to speculate a bit about the exact circuitry in that area of it. Whoops! That owners manual isn't in the ODK Ride-On manual library, either.

When the headlights are off, it is a quarter throttle to make the light go green.

Headlights on- AC switch- this would obviously make no difference to charging, I forgot to say, I retained the original 21w bulbs which came with the lamps.

DC switch- full throttle and the light is still red.

This doesn't concern me as the LED colours are-

�Less than 11.1V = Slow Red flash

�11.1V - 12.6V = steady Red

�12.6V - 15.4V = steady Green

�15.4V - 16.1V = steady Yellow

�Above 16.1V = Eye catching Yellow flash sequence

I have not got a test meter on it yet or run it for a long time with the lights on DC to see what the battery does, but to be honest my initial plan was if I did need to use it in the dark/dusk I would use the AC side, unless low engine speed or tick over was needed then use the DC side to make the lights brighter.



Yes I would imagine that if there was some kind of emergency and the diode failed I could always bypass the hour meter all together and run the wire from the engine side of the plug to the ignition switch/battery , this is how it runs in my 1988 MTD Lawnflite, no other wiring at all

Does that mean you didn't fit the LED light bulbs you bought? Those results are exactly what I'd expect with incandescent bulbs, but I thought you were using the LED ones, which is why I asked the question.

I didn't fit them, honestly the ones that I had are total rubbish at night, obviously cheap does not mean good when it comes from China through eBay!!

If they give less light than your 21W incandescent bulbs, it seems they may be stretching the truth, and you need something with more than "21W equivalent". I see that the 30W LED bulbs are nearly all headlight bulb type, with the wrong base for your lights. I only saw one person on ebay selling them with a bayonet base.

As you know, when your red light is on, your battery is discharging despite the engine running at maximum speed.

very nice and informative thread.
I have the same engine and the battery is not charging and neither the hour meter working.


we can see that the ac/dc is not connected.
neither the orange from ignition or the purple wire going to hour metre.
this is not the original engine and obviously they didn't do the modif properly.
how can i fix it?
thanks
Jerome

the drawing i have is not really clear.


*Now if i connect the orange wire from ignition directly to DC output, will i charge the battery this way?

*Also i don't understand where they take the positive power for hour meter looks like a red wire from the body (that doesn't make sense.)

That diagram does not make much sense by itself. It seems to be just part of the mower's wiring diagram.

The Briggs engine has a single wire that should be black, and a pair of wires that could be various colours, that connect to the mower itself. The single black wire is the kill wire: its only job is to stop the engine when it is grounded. People sometimes make the mistake of connecting this wire to +12 Volts when the engine is running: don't do it, that will destroy the ignition module.

The other pair of wires are the alternator output. They are connected together at the alternator, but one of them has a diode in it somewhere along its length - usually near the output connector that connects to the mower's wiring harness. The wire with the diode supplies DC, the one without the diode supplies AC.

If your engine has an electric starter, there will be a heavy wire from the starter motor. Most likely the mower's wiring will have a solenoid to operate the starter, but this is not a part of the engine.

[quote=Iceman][quote=Gadge][quote=Iceman]



In this picture could you please tell me where the orange wire is connected.
I believe that the wire with red terminal and diode goes to the key switch and the other with black sleeve should go to 12v+ pin on hour meter.
Can somebody confirm this is the correct way to do it.



I definitely have a diode connected on the red output wire (DC output) and nothing on black output Wire (AC output)

thank you all for your precious information.
jerome

Here is the wiring diagram for a Greenfield Evo 3 Mk 2:



As you can see, it is not exactly wired up like a 787, it is pretty rudimentary stuff.

Here are some Evo 3 models, including one with an hour meter:



Can you match one of these diagrams to your mower?

Thanks grumpy.
no nothing like this. But my mower is Evolution 2000 MKII with 15.5HP B&S.(originally B&S 16HP)

here is my configuration. just with harness 5 and 6 messed up by previous owner.



I successfully connect DC output directly to Key switch so now its charging at least and also I connected the Hour meter to key switch to.
So the clock tick now as soon as i turn ignition on. i don't really worry so much as i don't leave contact on if I'm not mowing. i may Add a Diode later on so the hour meter will only tick if engine is on.
Cheers.

I think you were very fortunate that the previous tenant did so little damage to the wiring.

yes i know especially when everything else on this mower is assembly up side down... this one was an easy fix. but only because of this forum.
thanks again guys.

jerome.

I'll close this thread.