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Joined: Oct 2010
Posts: 1,819 Likes: 6
Junior Technician
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I had a deutscher here for my dad but i think this one will be a better fit. I picked this one up for a good price. Engineless, it did have a 5hp briggs on it. A few cracks in the frame. I have a sad old SP mower here thats stuck in gear, its got a 6HP FJ180 Kawasaki on it that runs well. Hoping to fit it. ![[Linked Image]](https://www.outdoorking-forum.com.au/forum/uploads/usergals/2012/01/full-4181-4856-23dec11_002.jpg) ![[Linked Image]](https://www.outdoorking-forum.com.au/forum/uploads/usergals/2012/01/full-4181-4857-23dec11_001.jpg) ![[Linked Image]](https://www.outdoorking-forum.com.au/forum/uploads/usergals/2012/01/full-4181-4858-23dec11_003.jpg) ![[Linked Image]](https://www.outdoorking-forum.com.au/forum/uploads/usergals/2012/01/full-4181-4860-23dec11_004.jpg) ![[Linked Image]](https://www.outdoorking-forum.com.au/forum/uploads/usergals/2012/01/full-4181-4861-23dec11_005.jpg) Its not so easy to see where the cracks are. I will take some more pics once i have removed the guard off the driveshaft. I gave up and started throwing stuff last time i tackled it. Damn whitworth bolts, damn them all to hell.
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Joined: Oct 2010
Posts: 1,819 Likes: 6
Junior Technician
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Heres the pulley ![[Linked Image from img163.imageshack.us]](http://img163.imageshack.us/img163/5276/20jan12008.jpg) ![[Linked Image from img692.imageshack.us]](http://img692.imageshack.us/img692/2954/20jan12009.jpg) Bit hard to make out I think it was about 2-1/4 deep ![[Linked Image]](https://www.outdoorking-forum.com.au/forum/uploads/usergals/2012/01/full-4181-4862-20jan12_011.jpg) But theres a washer at the bottom ![[Linked Image from img651.imageshack.us]](http://img651.imageshack.us/img651/3076/20jan12010.jpg) Over all the pulley is just under 3" high. I was trying to work out how i was going to put a 1" pulley on a 7/8 crank. Then when i was measuring i worked out that it comes apart. Big hammer and some hard yakka. ![[Linked Image]](https://www.outdoorking-forum.com.au/forum/uploads/usergals/2012/01/full-4181-4863-20jan12_013.jpg) It was a pretty tight fit, the hole you can see is where the grub screw was holding the collar inside the pulley. Now i need to work out where i can get a 7/8 insert.
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Joined: Jan 2009
Posts: 6,926 Likes: 10
Pushrod Honda preferrer
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So it was only the press fit (and, ha ha, the grub screw) that was carrying the driving torque for the top pulley? That doesn't sound like competent engineering, especially for Greenfield, the minimum acceptable would be a medium press fit, or freezing the inner sleeve to an extremely low temperature before assembly. If they had done either of those, you wouldn't have separated them without a decent press or an oxy torch. Were the two pulleys attached to each other, say by some serious industrial adhesive?
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Joined: Oct 2010
Posts: 1,819 Likes: 6
Junior Technician
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The chunk on the left is one solid lump.
I sat it over the jaws of the vice. And layed into it with the mash hammer. I put a collar in the bottom to use as a drift, 1" dia with a hole bored throught it, wall thickness of 8mm or so. Its looking pretty mangled now. The washer is showing a bit of damage too.
It was in there pretty tight.
The machine is/was only 5HP.
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Joined: Jan 2009
Posts: 6,926 Likes: 10
Pushrod Honda preferrer
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If you were really laying into it, it might have been approaching the bottom end of a medium press fit. In my pre-press days I used to use the vice for up to 1 ton, and a shortened small sledge-hammer above that. From that I moved to a huge old O-frame flypress, which was great up to the limits of its frame size (about 15 inches). Then I inherited a serious press and life got easier. The big difference is the press tools you use. You frequently need a lathe to make a decent tool, so the is job easy, controlled, and unlikely to damage anything. These days if I only want a ton, I use the height-adjusting hand-wheel, up to 5 tons I don't even put the long handle into the pump lever, and by the time I get to 30 tons my feet are just about off the floor. From your description I suspect your sleeve took something slightly over 5 tons.
When I was a kid I needed to take the kingpins out of a 30 year old car. I tried with a 3 pound hammer and a purpose-made tool to hit. I achieved nothing, and asked my father to take it to his factory and use the press. (I figured that if necessary, he'd then have had a oxy torch ready to hand anyway.) He brought it back and told me what a whimp I was not to have removed them by hand. I asked him how much force the press had applied, and he said, "Oh, hardly anything, it was just on 15 tons". Nowadays, I'm spoiled like he was.
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Joined: Dec 2009
Posts: 125
Apprentice level 2
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My pulley is machined all in one piece with a 1" bore (.99" by calipers) Small pulley is 3" in diameter and large is 4.8"
I have just recieved new belts ordered as "blade and drive belts for Greenfield 28" self popelled slasher and they turned up as A25 and B60 - same as yours
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Joined: Dec 2009
Posts: 125
Apprentice level 2
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Sounds like Greenfields are a bit like BMC/Leyland - I'm restoring a Morris Mini 850 - 63 model. Judging by rhe variation of parts and trm fitted they must have had multiple sources each with different specs and put on the car what ever was in reach. Cars 100 apart in serial number can be fitted with totally different components
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Joined: Jan 2009
Posts: 6,926 Likes: 10
Pushrod Honda preferrer
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Back in those days the car manufacturers aimed to have more than one supplier of every component, in case there was a supply interruption from one of them. All parts, regardless of vendor, had to be interchangeable, so that the production line logistics would be as simple as possible. Thus they did, indeed, have multiple sources, and so long as the part had the same part number (which was not affected by who supplied it), any combination of them could be used in production. Your Mini is an example of a car built that way.
That system eventually changed, for practical reasons. Often one supplier's component was better than the other's, so having multiple suppliers meant using inferior components on some cars. Testing all combinations of parts on all car models made life very complicated for the car maker's engineering department. Essentially, the system amounted to making a worse product in order to have a more orderly assembly line logistics procedure. The Japanese never did it that way, and eventually, the better results they were achieving had an effect on all of the other manufacturers. Single vendors were chosen for many components, and where there was more than one vendor, the parts were not necessarily interchangeable as parts, but only as systems. Lots of vendors, who had proved themselves incapable of making world-class components, simply went away. The manufacturing logistics people were simply told to suck it up. Generally speaking, the cars got a whole lot better as a result.
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Joined: Dec 2009
Posts: 125
Apprentice level 2
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Rodeobob what size are the wheels on yours ? - they look bigger than mine
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Joined: Oct 2010
Posts: 1,819 Likes: 6
Junior Technician
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tyres are 12 5 -6
I was thinking that they might be too big as the deck does not sit flat.
I rang greenfield today. Spoke to Ken, nice bloke and a great help. The pulley being 3 piece threw him. He seemed like a switched on guy so he might be able to find me out more about it. He asked me to email him my address, he had a user and parts manual for the Ultimow but not in PDF so he was going to copy it and post it too me. I attached pics of the pulley hoping that will spur him into tackling the mystery. He had the parts list in front of him when i was talking to him, he said the sizes i had were right. 76 or something for the top 127 for the bottom 70mm total height. Perhaps the 3 piece is a tennants improvement.
I also asked about info for my old 'tractor', i think he said its a HD8. Hes going to post out copies of what hes got for me.
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1 member likes this:
Hazar24 |
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Joined: Oct 2010
Posts: 1,819 Likes: 6
Junior Technician
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Part number for the pulley is GT1973
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Joined: Dec 2009
Posts: 125
Apprentice level 2
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My wheels are 10-4-6 one is OK but the other is chopped about a bit
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Joined: Oct 2010
Posts: 1,819 Likes: 6
Junior Technician
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That would drop it an inch. Still looks like it needs more.
Perhaps i will lift the front up.
Will wait and see onces ive had a chance to go over the parts lists etc.
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Joined: Dec 2009
Posts: 125
Apprentice level 2
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The diagram on this Forum looks to have smaller drive and front wheels ( look like mine) than the later one as in the picture on this site
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Joined: Oct 2010
Posts: 1,819 Likes: 6
Junior Technician
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I may just change the castor on the front.
I dont want the meachine to be able to be set to 'eat dirt' if it can be, my dad will mow with it that way. Seeing how its all sand up there aluminium bodies dont stand much of a chance.
There are no real hills to speak of so the 6hp motor will be plenty.
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