Can't remember how much a gallon fuel was when I first started driving but I do remember that a jug of beer was 7 shillings and I think when we swapped to decimal currency that became 70 cents so about 10 cents a glass. Bottle of light beer at the pub last night $5.80
Hi all, I don't think the 3.3 Holden was that bad a motor compared with the Chrysler 245 it's just that the 202 suited a lighter car like the LX Torana.
CM Chrysler 3391 lbs Weight 245ci rating 153 (DIN) hp = 22.16 lbs per Hp / LX 2608lbs weight, 202 rating 118 (DIN) hp = 22.10 lbs per Hp .
Never had an interest in HQ to WB invented by captain understeer ,they went ok in a straight line if you dropped in a 350hp V8.
Cyberjack, like the poem, the picture I posted is open to infinite interpretations, much like the choices in life opening more branches of unexplored possibilities as you go along -or do they? I personally fail to see the connection to the poem (yet?), but I'm glad you do and thanks for sharing your very interesting take on the picture. I much appreciate it.
Ahh, if only victa had kept producing the thumblatch catcher series, they would be in better shape today!
Well I found this old picture of our first cars on a backup hard drive today. Going by the details on the photo it was taken on the 17th of September 2000.
Ok some details on the cars going from left to right. The first car was my mates Ford Fairmont XB Coupe 1974 model. This was a factory 302 Cleveland with the original factory fitted 2 barrel carby, t-bar auto, standard diff, it also had a twin exhaust system but it was fitted with aftermarket extractors and it really made it rumble. It only had a standard bonnet when he bought it and I helped him with getting a GT bonnet and we fitted it as you can see in the photo, it's still in undercoat but it was later painted in black to match the car. We also later fitted a GT front grille to the same car. It really made it look more tougher with the GT bonnet and GT front grille! A few years later we also fitted a 351 Cleveland to this car and also a 9 inch LSD diff with rear disc brakes as it still had the factory original single spinner diff with drum brakes in it. So it looked like a GT in the end except it wasn't an original one.
The second car was my mates Ford Falcon XF Utility 1988 model. It was just a factory 4.1 litre six cylinder car. He fitted the sporty headlights to that car and also that sporty front bar.
Third car was my red 1977 Ford Falcon XC GS Rally pack. It was a factory original car. 302 Cleveland with the standard 4 barrel carby, t-bar auto, LSD, twin exhaust system.
The last car on the right was another mates 1982 Ford Fairmont XE Ghia sedan. This was a factory 351 Cleveland car. I think it had all the options back then like power steering, air conditioning, power windows etc.
Certainly brings back some memories this old photo!
Cheers!
Zip a dee doo dah, zip a dee ay, another trash picked Victa, hip hip Hooray!
The XB's during their time were just such a great looking car after the average XA's appearance and then the XC upgrade was a slick / classy looking car with style. I always thought that the Rally Pack theme was a good money spinner for the Ford Motor Company regardless of what car they applied it to. Loved the European Escort with the Rally Pack option. I just never....... along with the motoring media ever thought that Chrysler's had any flair regardless of what they did or tried apart from the "Hey Charger" theme which was a really corny advertising hook.
Cheers, BB.
I live a 24 Hour lifestyle, but every now and again I seem to fall asleep, well at least that's what my wife tells me.
XC-lent example there Converse! I always liked those driving lights built into the grill for a sporty look. B_B I guess I like daggy grandpa cars what can I say? Here is what I get around in, a 1992 NCII Fairlane Ghia with LTD grill fitted. 302 Windsor on duel fuel. You can barely tell the difference and It eats hills. Parked next to a somewhat older model lol. I have added a pic of an immaculate XE Falcon S I recently came across too. A bonus shot for B_B lol!!
Great to see a lineup of Ford's only. Great friends you have there Converse.
Ahh, if only victa had kept producing the thumblatch catcher series, they would be in better shape today!
The HZ I only really liked in Premier guise which had the twin headlights. Never did like the singular version once the squarer HJ was released after the highly successful HQ
Last edited by Bonnar_Bloke; 02/08/1912:56 PM.
I live a 24 Hour lifestyle, but every now and again I seem to fall asleep, well at least that's what my wife tells me.
Nah, definitely the single headlight jobs for me Bonnar_Bloke. I grew up seeing my father driving various taxis through my childhood and we never had a family car, so the cabs he got to drive heavily influenced the cars I admired. That probably explains my fascination with trains and buses too! We used them a lot! I have a vivid memory of seeing a VJ Valiant take off from the local taxi rank with it's loud deep helicopter sounding exhaust bellow as a young kid around 1977 and I was instantly fascinated with the exhaust note and it stayed in my head and I was chuffed when my yellow Valiant made a similar sound when I got it in 1995. My dad drove an immaculately kept HZ Kingswood SL taxi in beautiful RSL cabs livery in early 80s and I particularly remember it's shiny metal wheel covers with the square Holden emblem in the centre, all in perfect condition. He got me to sit on his lap in the car park while I steered it on a couple of occasions! That Kingswood steering wheel is in my head now. I'll never forget the Legion Cabs base in Foveaux St Surry Hills in Sydney with a line up of XC Falcon cabs in Legion livery stabled there in 1978 when I went with my father. Years later when I pulled in there to fuel my car earlier this decade, the buildings hadn't changed much at all (it looked like a run down dungeon still!) except with a lineup of BA Falcon taxis in Legion livery. Sadly the base and all the buildings were sold to developers a few years ago and it's all gone now. I guess the central location became to valuable to use as a taxi base and they relocated to Arncliffe, near Sydney airport. I was actually amazed it was there that long.
Ahh, if only victa had kept producing the thumblatch catcher series, they would be in better shape today!
Cheers for that guys, Hey Mowerfreak I used to also sometimes get that my old XC was a bit of a grandpa's car aswell! LOL!
Nice Fairlane you have there with the 5 litre V8 Mowefreak, I also liked these fairlane models when I was looking at getting a first car but they were a bit out of my price range back then, I also liked the EB falcon with the 5 litre V8 but again a bit pricey back in 1998 to 1999. I remember my mate was looking to buy an EB Fairmont 6 cylinder back around 1998 from a car yard and they were asking around 11 grand for one back then. Also my mate who had that black XB his dad used to also be a taxi driver here in those days. I remember him telling me that he also mainly had Holden Kingswood sedans as the Taxi's back then.
Speaking of the upgrades from the XA-XB to the XC, having driven my mates XB on a few occasions when compared to my XC the main thing you can tell from the drivers seat was how high and surrounding the XA-XB cockpit style dash is when compared to the later lower and sleeker XC dash. Driving the XB I noticed that the dash was higher and more in frontal view while driving. With the XC they flattened out the front dash area making frontal visibility much better. But then again now you just see more of the bonnet and guards on the XC with the now larger frontal view! LOL! Anyway that's one of the main differences I remember between the XB and the XC from the interior driving position. I do think I preferred driving the XC when compared to the XB. I just like to see more of the muscle styled bonnet and guards while driving! LOL!
Talking about the old Holdens, my neighbour is an old timer and has had various Holden's all his life. Years ago I helped him quite a few times in the garage when he was working on the old HQ and HZ sedans he had both fitted with 253 V8 engines. Anyway I do remember him telling me that when it came to driving them the HQ used to sort of "float" around when driving. But he says that the HZ is superior and drives like it's on "rails" when compared to the HQ. So I am thinking that when Holden brought in the "RTS" (Radial Tuned Suspension) and maybe some other upgrades on the later models that it actually made a big difference to the handling of those cars. I do also remember looking at a couple of HZ sedans with the 308 V8 engine when looking for a first car, but again some were quite rusty and they were asking for 5 grand and higher.
I also looked a couple of Falcon XE V8's to buy for a first car, but again they were rusty and were asking over 5 grand. I reckon at some point I must have looked at all the Ford XC, Holden HZ and probably a couple of Falcon XE cars that were for sale in the trading post in Melbourne around 1998 to 1999! LOL!
Also forgot to mention, I must say that the original Mad Max movie and some various Bathurst 1000 video's from the seventies did have some influence on me and purchasing the XC falcon. I think I also got my mate onto these old models that ended up buying the XB Coupe... lol. I do remember him saying he can't forget that classic Ford 1-2 form finish in 1977. That also had some influence on the cars we bought back then.
I notice these days you mainly see cars like these only coming out to club meets and show days, but back then they were our everyday cars. We used to go to work and shopping with them, then cruising around with them on the weekends. Great times they were.
I also do remember when driving a car like that back then you always seem to attract others that want to race you at the lights! Many times the people in cars next to me would rev their engines up as to hint to a drag race at the lights! Then I also got alot of people that used to walk around shouting out "do a burnout", or something similar! LOL! Oh yeah those were the days!
Zip a dee doo dah, zip a dee ay, another trash picked Victa, hip hip Hooray!
The only thing I was ever able to find that was done to achieve this "RTS" suspension was that they moved the upper ball joint rearwards in the upper control arm by 15mm may have made a slight improvement but I think it was more a marketing thing.
I preferred the XA to the XB/XC ,it was a lighter car ,had less pollution gear and a higher compression V8 motor. The XA 302 V8 I owned everyone said it felt like a 351,never though about taking photos of it back then.
I have always thought the Ford front steering/suspension design to be pretty awful seeing that from 1960 it did not change much up until the EA.
Drove a 1969 HT Holden for years that handled a lot better than the 1988 XF Ford.
Owned a few 6 cylinder cortinas and a few 6 cylinder Toranas ,one was a LX 2 door with a worked 186.
I remember a guy owning a Holden HZ wagon 308 V8 that spent a heap of money making it go quicker it was still a slug so he sold it off and bought a LJ Torana 186 ,he used a performance head, manifolds ,carby and camshaft but the rest of the short motor was stock and the car did a 13.9 second 1/4 mile pass.
So the HT must handle better than the understeering pig of an HQ, yet it was the most prolific selling model Holden ever. Australians must have only begun appreciating handling in the late 70s as all three scrambled to make their charges handle decent toward the end. Holden with RTS, Ford with tweaks to an already decent handling XC model to suit radial tyres, and Chrysler with their locally developed handling package introduced during the last year of CL production, ready for the upcoming CM model. The Valiant reportedly stunned journalists with the transformation to dynamics. Some said it matched or exceeded the other two.
Ahh, if only victa had kept producing the thumblatch catcher series, they would be in better shape today!
Yeah the HT wasn't too bad for getting in a 4 wheel slide when taking a right angled corner and still making it around the corner but the same corner and the same speed with the 1988 XF and it would just under steer off the road.
I have a write up on the comparison between the standard HT 350 Monaro and the A9X 308 Torana, The RTS front was better than the HQ but the HT went around corners without the under steer of later models.
Btw, agree the XA was a nice car. I particularly liked the sedan's taillights. Very stylish numbers. Weirdly, I recall not noticing many at all even in the early 1980s whereas XBs and XCs were like grains of sand in comparison. Never liked the Fairlanes of the XA and XB eras but the LTD was an intriguing model with it's more square rear quarters and those concealed headlamps. The 1976-79 Fairlane and LTD were very nice indeed. There is a Fairlane of that era still going around in my area. It must be worth some dosh and I consider it more desirable and more prestigious than a Statesman.
Ahh, if only victa had kept producing the thumblatch catcher series, they would be in better shape today!
The Holden upper level cars were still always pegged at the masses due to the customer being able to order it in any configuration that they wanted from a 202 Three speed column shift through to a 350 Chevrolet powered V8 with either Auto or 4 speed floor shift manual while the LTD was definitely aimed at the upper class snobs and was pretty much offered in only one configuration...........V8 Auto.
Cheers, BB.
I live a 24 Hour lifestyle, but every now and again I seem to fall asleep, well at least that's what my wife tells me.
At least they weren't like Holden's afterthought-ish effort, the Brougham, which was a Premier with a longer tail tacked on with no difference in wheel base. Holden must have thought power windows option would fool them. A sign of contempt for the buying public. Ford showed professionalism and Holden obviously knew they couldn't continue that folly with their upcoming ultra modern HQ based bodies. It's a shame they got a former head of Cadillac to head HQ development. It took the wizard from Germany the much revered Peter Hannenberger to fix the disastrous dynamics of the pillow soft riding cars. I could have bought the green Brougham used in the film Dirty Deeds. It was in a front yard with $5000 in the window.
Ahh, if only victa had kept producing the thumblatch catcher series, they would be in better shape today!
Also drove a 186 HG ute for a few years that got around corners better than the 1988 XF ute.
All the HK HT HG Holden's had the same track and wheelbase measurements unless it had wider wider rims then the track would change.
It's just newer cars don't always handle better than older cars,I've driven 1980 Commodores that would handle better than a 2010 Hyundai .
I was told with the early XA, that Ford got the rustproofing so wrong it actually rusted the car quicker than no rustproofing,I think you did not see a lot of the XA's around years later because they rusted out.
Don't know if the rustproofing story is right just what I was told.
I did hear Ford fitted left over phase 3 GTHO motors to some of the Ford Landau models.
When people say old Fords and Hq to Wb handle good they have never compared them with a 1978 RX7.
On the race-track, the Mazda’s light weight and durability ensured excellent results. The most obvious beneficiary was Allan Moffat, who abandoned his long-running Ford allegiance for a peripherally-ported RX7 that won the Canadian his 4th Australian Touring Car title. Moffat’s international results included first in class at the 1982 Daytona 24 Hour sports car race.
Go easy on the Huyandai's, nothing special about them but they are probably the best value for money car on the market in Aus and have been for a long time
Hi BB, never had an issue with parts for them we have 2 of them and they have been so cheap and reliable to run. Many years ago I had an E2200 Mazda and when I needed parts for it I would go to the dealer, put my wallet on the counter and say to them, "thats all I've got" they would usually say I was being a bit dramatic, but my reply was " no I'm being serious"
Hi Norm, I agree Norm the Hyundai is a good car for it's price, I've serviced one for a family member for the last 9 years, all that it's needed was tyres, servicing and it's just had it's first set of front brake pads changed and just had it's first battery replaced.
I've found parts for the Hyundai are very reasonable on eBay compared with the Hyundai dealer.
The only complaint I would have is the driving position feels uncomfortable after driving for a few hours compared with the Aussie cars .Obviously designed for shorter Koreans.
The Dirty Deeds Brougham would be worth a lot more now I would imagine.
I don't mind what cars people drive,most cars aren't made to be street racers,as long as they get you from A to B.
I can't imagine the old Ford LTD as a race car but what people may not know is the extra foot of sheet metal tacked onto the prem to make a Brougham actually made the Brougham handle better than other Holden models.
The 1968 Kingswood HK 307ci ,powerglide won state titles for off road racing,I don't think if you raced the LTD off road it would be a success.
I guess I wasn't being specific, I meant panel work etc not general consumables like brakes and general maintenance parts.
They charged $100 for the plastic badge that says Terracan on a mates Hyundai that he was putting back on the road.
The damaged vehicle auctions used to sell Exels for next to nothing because they weren't worth a cracker due to all their sheetmetal costing an arm and a leg. It was all about selling the cars cheap and catching you on the flip side with parts and panels etc.
Cheers, BB.
PS. BTW MaxW that Brougham depicted above no longer exists, nor does that rego number here in SA.
I live a 24 Hour lifestyle, but every now and again I seem to fall asleep, well at least that's what my wife tells me.
BB, its good to know I am not the only one who does rego searches on the plates on cars in the old magazines/photos.
I know a few people who have had good runs out of the X2 & 3 excels, but also have seen the results of the crashed ones. Then again, some also had reasonable runs out of Lada Niva's and Samara's
Max, I have a 2006 Tuscon and agree with the seating position - I am not tall and I have the seat as far back as it will go.
Yep a lot of the dealers like to charge ridiculous prices for spare parts ,I remember people going to Toyota for a replacement plastic hubcap in 1990 and nearly having a fit when they got the price,from memory I think the hubcaps were around $160 each.
If you got the Holden Apollo parts from Holden some parts were half the price compared with getting the same part from Toyota for the Camry, the Apollo was just a rebadged Camry.
Yes the seating position and the positioning of the pedals aren't great with the Hyundai .
That Brougham pic with the SA number plate was from 1984 when the average Brougham cost $1000.
The new price of the Brougham with a 308 was more than buying a GTS 350 Monaro, no wonder the Brougham never sold well.
There was the same case apparently with the Mazda parts (323/laser and 626/telstar) parts prices being of the same case - Ford getting better government import credits due to the local falcon production enabling cheaper sale prices of both the initial car itself and aftersales.
I guess the Commodore plus the Family 2 Camtech 4 engine production (significant export) had the same impact on Holden Apollo parts pricing
