I pulled this stator off an old Briggs that was in a mates Greenie and he never complained about it not charging and the other half was not inside the flywheel, so I can only assume it was working, just have to work out what rectifier I need for it
Hi AVB, What surprised me with this is my mate never complained about it not charging, but not long after I fitted a new Chonda to his Greenfield he rang me and said he didn't think it was charging. I asked him why and he said he didn't know just thought it wasn't. Next time I was up the bush at his place I put the multi meter on it and 14 volts no problems. I have fitted a few Chondas on rideons and I have always just plugged the Chonda stator wire into the existing plug and they have always charged fine
Hi AVB, I assume I just plug this into the plug coming from the stator and the red wire goes to battery positive and this should be the same if I fit a Chonda motor to it which is looking like the better option?
Norm, This why we must first determine which stator you actual have. There are multiple configs out there as you could see from the chart I linked. That voltage reg you linked is for 10,13, and 15 stators. Then there is the dual stator which has just a diode for the DC side and there is AC side for lighting.
Thanks AVB, Pretty sure these 2 Briggs will go to the scrapper, I'm not wasting any more time on them, for $450 I can get brand new 14hp motors, bolt it on and instant start So I'm thinking that the half stator I had was the D/C side of the stator as it only has a single wire coming from it. Interesting is that I just plugged the new Chonda stator wire into the existing plug on the Greenie and it charges fine and has been running for quite a few years now
Ok my latest saga with the 2 Briggs motors not charging. New stators, new rec/regs and still only getting about 10.6 volts out of the rec/regs. My head was hurting and I had no idea what was going on, getting 25 volts A/C out of the stator. In the end I cut one of the wires from the stator and instantly 13 volts at the battery. I did the same to the other motor with the same result, charging problems solved. I have no idea why they work like this but they do. It is charging fine using half the stator. Anybody have any reason why this is happening because I certainly don't have a clue
Here is a suggestion Norm that can help a lot. The posting of the model and type numbers and the PN of the stator you are working would certainly help those like me that is half way around the world. It is something you being doing for all the equipment as being able to see the IPLs is usually very helpful in troubleshooting.
Personally I gave up on the crystal balls as they are just to cloudy lately.
Here is a suggestion Norm that can help a lot. The posting of the model and type numbers and the PN of the stator you are working would certainly help those like me that is half way around the world. It is something you being doing for all the equipment as being able to see the IPLs is usually very helpful in troubleshooting.
Personally I gave up on the crystal balls as they are just to cloudy lately. Asking for help without giving us much to work is nothing but guessing game.
It kind of sounds like the wires were mixed up going to the rec/reg ,the 2 wires from the stator ,one wire goes to the rec/reg for battery DC charging and the other wire from the stator is an AC current that goes to power the headlights and remains AC.
Thanks Max, I did think that might have been the case. These stators just have 2 yellow wires and no diode in either one unlike the ones with the red and black wires with the red wire having the diode in it No mushrooms here AVB, I don't know what these numbers are these covers have been swapped around and on this OHV motor I'm not even sure of the HP because the sticker was missing, it has the Intek plastic fan shroud. I'm just guessing it is 10.5 I'm playing a guessing game as well, but alls well that ends well, both batteries are charging and I can move on to my next problem machines 3 Deutscher rideons that have been sitting here for many years
That is an AC stator and requires the 691185 regulator. Cutting a wire should had killed it as the windings are normal not grounded unless there is a defect in the stators. but of course the ones I referring to are full circle stator and not a half circle ones.
So something just don't sound right.
Also there a MS sheet that might need applying as there is possible shorting issue.
Yes AVB, Mystery to me the stator and re/reg came in the one package and plugged together so I have no idea why they would not charge, putting out 25 volts A/C but as soon as I plugged the rec/reg in I could only get 10.6 volts D/C coming out of the red wire. I tried bridging each yellow stator wire individually to the rec/reg and both wires delivered 13 volts to the battery so it didn't matter which wire I cut
Still scratching my head a bit with these charging systems. The stators with the red and black wires with the red wire having the diode in it, does this diode rectify the voltage from A/C to D/c or does it just prevent any backfeed into the stator. I hear stories that this wire can go to the battery but if this is the case there in no regulator to prevent overcharging the battery?
I think you have the gist of it ,A rectifier on the red wire converts alternating current (AC) from the stator into direct current (DC) for the battery. It also acts like a diode by allowing current to flow in one direction (to the battery) while preventing reverse current from flowing back to the stator, protecting the electrical system.
Yes, using a voltage regulator between the rectifier and the battery is generally a good idea in applications like this.
As we know. Voltage Regulation: The output from the stator and rectifier can fluctuate depending on the engine speed. Without regulation, this voltage could exceed the battery's rated voltage (usually around 12.6 to 14.4 volts for a standard lead-acid battery), leading to overcharging and potentially damaging the battery.
It does get a little confusing Norm because of what people call the rectifier when referring to the charging system.
I thought you had already tested the stator output to confirm the red wire has a Rectifier diode ( converts AC to DC)
This is something you test or look up part numbers to be sure what you have as there are a few different charging systems.
If the red wire doesn't convert AC to DC then it must just be a Diode.
Non-Rectifying Diode or Protection Diode: There are instances where the diode serves a different purpose, such as:
Flyback or Protection Diode: It might be used to prevent voltage spikes or back EMF from damaging the stator or electrical components, but this typically will still serve to redirect current rather than perform rectification.
In some systems, particularly where DC is necessary, the diode is used primarily for protection rather than full rectification, but this would be less common.
If the component in question is converting AC (alternating current) to DC (direct current), it is functioning as a rectifier diode
The rectifier diode also prevent reverse flow of current back to the stator.
People can refer to the rectifier diode as just a rectifier or just a diode but the correct term is rectifier diode if it converts AC to DC.
It's a Rectifier that has diodes inside so people call it a diode or rectifier , if you test the DC output and it's unregulated your rectifier doesn't have an inbuilt regulator.
The primary function of a rectifier is to convert alternating current (AC) to direct current (DC), and this is accomplished by using diodes.
Additionally, check if there are any additional components in your charging system that may also contribute to voltage regulation
1 With the Basic Rectifier: If it is simply a diode rectifier, then it will only convert AC to DC without regulating the voltage. In this case, the output voltage can vary with engine speed and can exceed the desired voltage, potentially leading to overcharging the battery.
A basic rectifier, which is typically a half-wave or full-wave rectifier using diodes, will not regulate the voltage of the DC output. It will simply convert the AC input to a pulsating DC output, which can vary in amplitude depending on the AC input and the diode characteristics.
2 Full-Wave Rectifier: Uses multiple diodes (typically four in a bridge configuration) to convert both halves of the AC waveform into DC.
A full-wave rectifier uses diodes arranged in such a way (often in a bridge configuration) to allow both halves of the AC waveform to contribute to the output, resulting in a smoother pulsating DC output compared to a half-wave rectifier.
When people refer to a "diode" in the context of rectification circuits, they are often referring to the role that diodes play in the rectification process.
Some Stators have a Rectifier Regulator All-in-One.
Steps to Identify a Rectifier Regulator All-in-One
Labeling: Look for labels or markings on the component. If it is indeed a rectifier regulator, it may be labeled as such. Common terms include "Regulator/Rectifier" or simply "R/R."
Physical Characteristics: These units are typically larger than a standard rectifier / diode
The following is a list to lest the rectifier .
Multimeter Testing for a Rectifier Regulator All-in-One.
AC Voltage Testing: With the engine running, check the AC output from the alternator (typically using AC voltage settings on a multimeter) before the component. You should get a rising AC voltage as the engine speed increases.
DC Voltage Testing: Measure the output voltage from the suspect component while the engine is running. If you get a stable DC voltage (usually around 12-14 volts) regardless of engine speed after the component, it's likely functioning as a rectifier regulator.
No Load Comparison: Check the voltage with and without load; if the voltage remains stable within the normal operating range under varying loads, it suggests regulation is also occurring
Check the part number of your rectifier or regulator and look for its specifications online or in a parts catalog. Most manufacturers provide documentation indicating whether a part is just a rectifier, just a regulator, or a combined rectifier regulator.
To determine if you have a rectifier regulator all-in-one for a Briggs and Stratton motor, look for labels, consult wiring diagrams, perform voltage tests, and check manufacturer specifications. This examination will clarify whether the part serves both the rectifying and regulating functions.
- Hi Max, I don't know why they make it so difficult, these charging systems have followed the same principle since they came up with alternators back in the sixties. Nothing unique about the Briggs setup, a stator and a rec/reg to direct power to the battery
- Hi Max, I don't know why they make it so difficult, these charging systems have followed the same principle since they came up with alternators back in the sixties. Nothing unique about the Briggs setup, a stator and a rec/reg to direct power to the battery
It all about saving a penny here and there. And also getting more money as we have to upgrade these charging systems.
You know its the guys with the pencils sharped on both ends.
Yes Briggs made it more difficult than it needed to be with about 30 different stators plus all the different wiring .
The easiest way to know what you have is to do a test or get the part numbers then do a search.
As far as I know with cars the RV1 Valiant from 1961 had Alternators and was told Holden EH had them but only as a heavy duty option and alternators were standard in the HD Holden.
Hi Max, I can't remember if the EH came out with an alternator, I have a feeling that it might have been the HD which came out with disc brakes as well, but the highly dangerous vent window that opened inwards that could catch your hand on the steering wheel if you weren't careful
I've never seen an original EH with a factory alternator but helped an auto elec rebuild alternators and starters a long time ago and remember him saying EH were the first Holdens with alternators.
I've also seen others that say it was an option on some EH cars.
Good review on the EH there Max. From what I remember the EJ even though it still had a grey motor it was fitted with the new style gearbox where you could leave the bell housing on and unbolt the box and fit a new clutch. Much easier to do than having to completely remove the box on the earlier models
Yes I remember the EJ alloy bolt on bell housing well Norm.
I had a good EJ box here ,they were so small, must have been the smallest Holden gearbox ever ,ended up throwing the gearbox out, couldn't find anyone that wanted it ,I did manage to get rid of a few earlier cast iron bell housing gearboxes though,the only non synchro first gear Holden gearbox I used in a vehicle was an EH 3 speed from a 179 which had bigger gears than the EJ box and I converted it to floor shift ,from memory I think the EH 3 speed was still the same gearbox used in HK.
It was a while ago Norm probably at least 10 years ago.
I don't think you will find too many people these days that would want a non synchro first 3 speed box , there is one listed for $50 now online it says EJ but is EH.
The wreckers was full of olld Holdens with recently reco motors and they sold complete motors for $50.,the V8 motors were the same price but mostly 253.complete RB30 motors were also $50.
Had a heap of old Holdens and just scrapped them as they weren't worth selling , people would give you cars for free or you could buy a complete car for $50.
I'm getting to the stage with these E/S Deutschers that it might be easier to just have them on $10 trickle charger all the time because how many times a year are they going to be used for cleaning up around under the fruit trees? Probably 3 times a year which means the battery will probably go flat between mows
Hi Max, I have a 12 volt system running through my house, it powers the smoke detectors the CO2 monitors, kitchen clock, street number out the front, light at the front door and a 12 volt pump in the garage downstairs as a back up if we loose power here and a high water alarm in the sump pit which alarms if the 12 volt pump activates. I have a battery each end of the house and they are on constant trickle charge, battery maintainer and have been for years now. The only time I had trouble with a battery overcharging was when I got smart and hooked it up to a solar panel. It worked fine until the controller stuffed up and cooked one of the batteries. That battery is still connected and works fine just powering my system but if I put any load on it it falls over. Anyway these little trickle chargers don't seem to overcharge the battery. I think they put out 1000 milliamps, which is probably what a battery looses just sitting these
So you just use a charger like the one below to maintain the batteries ,I need to get something to maintain a battery just not sure if to go solar or electric plug in.
I have heard some of the small solar charger panels only last 4 years.
Hi Max, I am using these chargers, have been using them for years with no problem. I have 5 of them hooked up running 24 hours a day with no issues at all and they use virtually no power at all and I monitor my power daily. The solar panel I set up was only a cheap Chinese thing and it only lasted probably 18 months before it went haywire and cooked the battery.
