OutdoorKing Repair Forum Forums Repairs and Maintenance Questions On Ride On Mowers Questions on Greenfield Ride On Mower Frames Greenfield Squeals Loudly on Start-up

I just purchased a used Greenfield Anniversary 12Hp 32�. It squeals loudly for a few seconds when first started and then runs fine. Do I need to tighten a belt or something? The guy I purchased it from said he had recently had new belts fitted and the mower mechanic said he wasn't sure why it was making that noise upon start up. Thanks in advance for the help!

Hi figarow, welcome to Outdoorking.

I'm assuming you start the machine with the cutter clutch disengaged - normally ride-on mowers will not start otherwise. I'm also assuming that the squeal begins immediately, when the engine starts - it isn't something that only happens when you step on the drive pedal.

My first guess as to what would cause a symptom like that, is a belt idler that is more or less seized on its shaft. The Greenfields have more idlers than most mowers, so finding out whether that is the problem, and if so which idler is at fault, is the tricky bit.

Here is an illustration of the parts of your mower, unfortunately scanned in very low definition so it is not especially useful:



There is a pair of idlers (Item 72) which guide the wheel-drive belt, and those might be a good place to start your investigation. You could inspect their condition, and perhaps oil them and see if that eliminates the noise.

Please report back - if that isn't it, we can look further. Also, there are quite a few experienced Greenfield owners on Outdoorking, any of whom might be able to identify the problem easily.

Many thanks for the help Grumpy. I'm not very mechanical but a fast learner. The mower is still in my trailer I only just picked it up yesterday. Will let you know how I go over the next few days.

Here is a picture of the beast:



Here is what the guy recently replaced:

New Battery
New starter motor
New magtronic ignition
New blades
New (3) belts
New (front 2) tyres

What he replaced isn't important, Figarow. What matters is what he didn't replace that he should have. You'll find out what, if anything, is in that category before long. That is part of the reason to buy things second-hand: it's much more exciting.

True grumpy!

Ok have just given it an oil change and checked the air filter which was fairly dirty so i have washed in hot water and detergent. Once dry can I put it back as is or do I need to oil it?

It depends which kind of air cleaner it has Figarow. Briggs has two main types on the side valve engines: the single stage type, and the two stage type. The single stage type uses a block of urethane foam as the filter element. This type is serviced by washing the foam in petrol to remove both the dirt and the dirty oil it had previously been soaked in. It must then be re-oiled by squirting some engine oil on it and wringing as much of the oil out of it, as is possible without tearing the foam. The two stage type has a foam pre-filter around a paper filter. They are serviced by cleaning and oiling the pre-filter exactly like a solid foam filter. The paper filter is serviced by blowing air through it outward from the center, so that dirt goes back the way it came in, rather than blowing it deeper into the filter.

In theory there is no wet-cleaning process suitable for use on paper filters. In practice some of us have been known to experiment, more or less successfully, but Briggs does not approve.

OOPS

Its the paper type, this one:

It does not look as if the paper has been oiled, so it is just a matter of somehow getting it dry, and taking a close look at it. Think of it as an experiment. If it ends up with no holes in it, try it on the engine and see if it runs properly (a restrictive air cleaner causes rich mixture). If you look at that filter, you will see that it has a flange top and bottom. The flange is designed to hold a thin urethane foam pre-filter. Most filters come with an oiled pre-filter installed on them, and when they do, you remove the pre-filter and clean/re-oil it regularly. You inspect the paper element simultaneously, but it lasts a long time if it has an oiled foam pre-filter around it. When I see one like yours with a space for a pre-filter but without one installed, I suspect that somebody was trying to promote the sale of replacement filters.

Sorry that was one I found on the Internet. The actual filter is below. I was on the phone to a guy I know who is a mechanic and he said do not put that filter back in. He said the water will likely damage the paper and cause fibers of paper to get in, although he did say I might get away with it, but not having a compressor to test makes it difficult. I won't be able to buy a new filter for a week so because we don't make the trip to town too often so not sure if I should dare try put this one back in.. what do you think? Oh and yes it is a bit of oil on the underside of the filter (pic 3).

Your mechanic gave you the correct advice Figarow, but there are rabid experimenters who wash them anyway. If you google the subject you will see some reports from those people. Sometimes they succeed, in a fashion, and sometimes they fail.

I've never washed a paper element in water myself. I have washed a completely sludged and oil-soaked paper element in petrol - 8 times IIRC - and it seems to be OK.

There are only two bad things your washed element can do: it can leak dirty air, or it can restrict the amount of air that it passes. You can inspect it to see if it has become excessively porous, but it is more difficult to find out if it has become restrictive. I would assess that by checking whether the engine ran richer with it fitted than without it fitted, but you need a fair amount of experience to make that evaluation.

The best solution is to follow your mechanic's advice.

Hi all, just throwing in my 2 bobs worth. another thing that sqeals on these is the starter clutch. Unlikely in this case but possible.

Washing Paper air filters is perfectly fine.. Just make sure they are dry before putting them back on..

As BigTed said, Check the starter clutch.. Very likely possibility.

Kori

Good thinking guys, the symptom does sound like a starter clutch. That one didn't occur to me for some reason.

Thanks guys, the starter clutch is there a way to test it to see if that is the cause? Or is this issue something I should just ignore? Ie doesn't affect anything else / won't degrade parts quicker.

I'm not risking the air filter, have one on order and a fuel filter should be able to install next few days.

Option 1: If the engine has an electric starter as well as the rewind starter, just remove the rewind starter and see if the squeal goes away. If it does go away, follow Option 2.

Option 2: If it doesn't have an electric starter, you need to remove, dismantle, clean and lubricate the pull start. If you post the Model, Type and Code information, I should be able to post instructions for doing this.

Do not ignore the problem. If it is the starter, very soon the squealing shaft and bearing will seize, the starter will spit out its cord, and it will probably be ruined.

It is both electric and pull start. The pull start cord has about 200mm slack. Not sure if this is normal but when pushing the electric start button there is a 1 or 2 second delay before it turns over. I have the information for the motor below. Many thanks for help!

Model:
281707

Type:
0148-01

Code:
88071931

The engine was made on 19 July, 1988, in Brigg's engine plant in the Czech Republic. That plant has now closed, by the way.

Here is the Illustrated Parts List for the engine:
http://bsintek.basco.com/BriggsDocumentDisplay/Z6ntzHVJ1DajI.pdf

Here is the Operator's Manual:
http://bsintek.basco.com/BriggsDocumentDisplay/mssAIQ-K_ny7tH217FzoPu.pdf

The slack rewind cord on the starter supports the notion that it has partly seized internally. If you look at Page 5 of 12 in the IPL, you will see this illustration:



You can see that it has a normal Briggs sprag clutch. This type of starter is prone to squealing, and paying out some of the rewind cord as it runs, when it has insufficient lubrication.

Here is the page from the manual giving instructions for how to service this clutch - note particularly that you place only one drop of oil on the shaft, and ensure that the sprags, balls, and ball compartments are completely dry and clean:



I apologise for previously posting an illustration of the pawl clutch, used only on the small engines.

It seems you will need to service it. I suggest you remove it and report whether it makes a difference to the start-up squeal. While it is off, you can lubricate it.

Wow thanks a lot Grumpy for the engine info! Much appreciated!! Waiting for air filter to arrive and then I can remove pull start and test as you suggested. And thanks for the instructions for lubricating, was about to ask how do that

You shouldn't need to open up the sprag clutch Figarow, just inspect and oil (1 drop) the end of the crankshaft where it extends into the starter. However if the recoil starter is showing any signs of slipping, or sticking in engagement, you will need to clean the clutch. Because it is a sealed one, it shouldn't need that unless the previous tenant sprayed the clutch with lubricant and thus messed it up.

Please come back and confirm when you have verified that it was the clutch, and there is no other problem.

And bigted, thanks for chipping in when I missed the clutch issue earlier in this thread.

I installed the air filter and started it up. This time it squealed for a few minutes on high and low revs, I noticed the pull cord unwinding almost to the ground and then slowly going back into place. It stopped squealing after I stopped and re-started it.

Upon deciding to tackle the sprag clutch I continued to try and remove the top of the pull start which is held in by 4 screws, 1 of the screws has a semi stripped head which wont move and the other I can't get a spanner or socket on, is there any other way in to the sprag clutch or should I try and drill these screw out?