OutdoorKing Repair Forum Forums Repairs and Maintenance Questions on Engines Questions On Honda Engines Chonda GX200 clone wiring help

Hi, I am attempting to rig up a remote OFF/RUN/START switch on the handlebars of an old Rover slasher/mower using a motorbike control switch. To do this I will need to splice into the wires on the Chonda control panel. There are lots of shielding and covers making it difficult to see which parts of the spaghetti belong where, and to make it more difficult the Chonda motors seem to use different coloured wires to Honda. However the connectors are the same, so it should be easy enough to work them out from those.

Can somebody with far more technical expertise than myself please double check my wiring? For one thing I was not quite sure if the charging coil should go to both RUN and START on the switch, but that is the way it looks on the schematic?

The wording is a bit confusing. Instead of OFF/ON/RUN, Honda uses OFF/RUN/START, so "RUN" does not necessarily mean the engine is running at this key position. It just means the circuits required for running the engine are open.

Hi VM,

Think of it as off earths out the coil wire to ground (negative)

In the on or run position the starter key switch doesn't need to touch any wires together in this position.The on /run is the same.

The start position just energizers the starter solenoid so battery positive to the starter solenoid .

The 3 key positions are OFF/ (ON RUN) /START

If you are using a motorbike ignition switch it may not work as you need a switch that when it's in the off position it has 2 different
connectors that complete a circuit and they don't all work like that.

The charging coil is connected to positive no mater what position the switch is in .

Cheers
Max.

Problem with using a motorbike switch is they use a 12 volt system and that means their coil is powered by 12 volts, you switch the ignition of, that shuts power to the coil and the motor stops. With mower motors they use magneto ignition and once the motor is started (all the battery is
required to do on mower engines is spin the motor over like a pull starter) and then the only way to stop the motor is to earth out the coil. You can use the motorbike ignition key and the start button but you then need a kill switch button to kill the magneto

Thanks Max and Norm,

Unfortunately I don't quite follow, as I was hoping to just get a confirmation on the wiring in my diagram, on which I marked the key positions in red. Any other diagrams just add to my confusion.

The old Harley control switch has OFF/RUN/START. I would have thought this setup exactly the same, unless I am missing something?

Failing that, these control switches are a dime a dozen on ebay, which should do the job as the switch is said to be a "kill switch".

What we were saying VM is the motor bike ignition switch won't work because it's the same principle as a car the switch when off
cuts power to the coil and a mower and a some motor bikes like road trail without a battery earth out the coil when the switch is off..

I usually just check the switch with an ohm meter in the off position ,then run ,then start to work out what wires are what.

The other diagrams I thought were easier to follow

Cheers
Max.

Hi Max, According to my original schematics, nothing is connected on "RUN". This seems to match well with your re-drawing of it.

I should add that I am not talking about replacing the key entirely. I intended to leave the key stuck in RUN position and splice into the existing wires for the remote starting/stopping.

Also, I would have thought a kill switch is a kill switch and a starter button is a starter button, no matter what the application? One switch has two wires and flicks on/off, whether it be to a coil or to a ground. The button is just a typical momentary push button, again with two wires. A friend has this on a Go-Kart which just has an ordinary engine like on a motor mower. I will have to take a look at how he did it next time I see him. I am having difficulties seeing why this will not work, as it is really just a simple bypass.

Example:

https://www.ebay.com.au/itm/296374168158?

Or maybe as I am leaving the key in RUN position, all I really need is the starter button, so something like this, plus a separate on/off flick switch?

https://www.ebay.com.au/itm/354497975400?

But basically, both methods are the same.

Switches are not the same, momentary only allows power through the switch when you press it, this will earth out the magneto. With coil ignition you require constant power through the switch till you turn it off to kill power to the coil. For a magneto you require a N/O switch, for coil ignition you require a N/C switch
The Harley switch you put up is a N/C switch for coil ignition, not a magneto

Thanks Norm, So can rule out the old Harley and the ebay one that is advertised for a motorbike.

But the ebay momentary button is an N/O switch. How will it earth out the Magneto when both wires on the momentary push switch are positive and none go to Earth?

For ON/OFF, I reckon I can just use an ordinary flick switch but in reverse manner, so ON position is OFF, OFF position is ON. I had one on the old Honda engine to switch it on and off. Just had to mount it upside down.

They do usually have a earth on one switch that goes to the handle bars that you don't see as it's part of the mounting clamp
that's why they only have one kill switch wire VM. Three wires total.

I can't advise what wire goes where as there is nothing that tells you the wiring diagram for the switch on eBay as you check
the wiring with an ohm meter when you have the switch in your hand ,the red button is usually the kill switch and the grey
button is for the starter solenoid

Cheers
Max..

Thanks Max, I'll test it all out with a multimeter first, to see how the wiring works.

This one has two wires forming a connection when pushed and nothing on it earths. It is an N/O momentary switch. Already have one of these in the shed and know how it works.

Then that switch would be a starter switch ,one wire to the battery positive and the other wire to the solenoid wire VM

On other equipment the positive to this switch would be taken from the ignition key switch when it's in the on position otherwise
the push switch will always work when it's pushed.


Cheers
Max.

Thanks Max,

I notice you can get waterproof buttons as well for marine applications, not that I will ever be mowing in the rain. Haha!

There is also this variant among the cheaper Chinese control switches which has four wires, two independently to each switch. But of course the ON/OFF switch will be backwards (OFF will be ON and ON will be OFF) unless there is a way to get inside and flip it.

Vint_mow,
The N/O ebay switch can be used as a kill switch, one wire comes from the magneto wire and the other wire from the switch goes to earth. It is not allowing power to flow through the switch while the motor is running but when you close the switch it allows power to go through to earth and this kills the magneto coil. The switch you put up in your last post is for coil ignition, but you could use the horn button wires as a kill switch but there is plenty of cheaper kill switches out there. I set up a small quad bike recently with 2 handelbar switches, one for a start button, one for the kill switch. Both switches are the same and are N/O switches

Thanks for your help Norm,

I've since been told that when it comes to those generic Chinese controls, if the ON is marked as a circular arrow at the TOP of the control (typically RH side mount), this is an N/O switch. However if the TOP of the control is marked with a crossed out circular arrow, that is an N/C switch.

So the example I showed in my previous post is more likely to be an N/C switch.

The one in the photo below is an N/O switch and stated as such by the seller.

It is rare for sellers to tell buyers if the switch is N/O or N/C. I can only guess a lot of those online sellers are simply flogging these switches off, probably without knowing or caring exactly which kind of switch they are. There must be lots of people buying them, only to discover that they got the wrong type when it arrives.

EDIT: See photo and wiring diagram attached.

Ok vint_mow I didn't know they made a motorcycle kill switch like that for magneto ignitions so there you go

Norm, I've gotten myself in a bit of a muddle because technically speaking a normally open (NO) switch is an electrical switch that is in an open state when not activated. When activated, the switch closes the circuit and allows current to pass through. Normally open means that the switch or contact (when it is not compressed or activated) doesn't let current flow through in its normal state.

As this switch is closed in the off position, that technically means it is a N/C switch, but as the "activation" in this case is to kill the engine, I guess that is why it is viewed here as an N/O switch? Is that correct or am I getting myself confused?

I do understand that the momentary push button has to be an N/O switch.

Not sure what you are getting at there vint_mow but you can only use a N/O switch on a magneto, brush cutters, mowers blowers. I am working on a pressure washer with an electric start Chonda on it at the moment. If I can get to the back of the switch block I may be able to see where the wires go

Not sure if this is the type of switch you are working with. Problem is I can't get it open any further to see what is going on with the wires in there

I guess what I'm saying is the toggle switch will technically be an N/C switch even though the starter part of the switch works on the N/O principle. With a magneto, kill switches are backwards to what you find in a car or motorbike. OFF is ON and ON is OFF. So for a mower an ON/OFF flick switch is basically just an upside down N/C switch.

I was wrong in my earlier photo when I suggested one of those Chinese switches is N/C and the other N/O. They are in fact both N/C switches, although the "push button" part is N/O. I will probably end up buying one to satisfy my own curiosity and see if there might be some way to reverse the wiring (or the entire switch) to turn that part of the switch into an N/O switch.

That is the same control panel Norm. I had the same problem in not being able to see which wire goes where and some of the Chondas tend to use different coloured wiring to the original Honda. I can only guess they use whatever wire they have around. The connections are the best at showing which wire is which.