OutdoorKing Repair Forum Forums Restoring, Customising and Modifying Reel-Type Mowers SB 45 - dual project (newbie)

Hi guys,

I've lurked in the shadows for a while and the way you all share information has given me the courage to start a project of my own - I'm going to attempt to restore 2 Scott Bonnar 45 mowers.

I was just going to buy one and then I found another one with the same model number, so I have the intention of having a crack at one first and then gifting it (if successful) to my dad for Christmas. He shares in my love of all things lawn/mowers. Once I've got some experience with that one, I'll try to restore the second one for myself. Mower #1 won't kick over because it hasn't been started in a year or so...so that's going to be my first job - getting it running.

The catch? I'm a 30 year old female and I don't have any experience taking on this sort of a project, so I would really appreciate your advice and support as I try to tackle this.

Mower #1:










I pick up mower #2 on Saturday:



It is in working order, but I won't touch it until the other is complete.

Hi emk3,

Wow, now that's an eager projected project. BTW welcome to the ODK Forum.

Well you're certainly going to have your hands full taking on two.

What you have there is special run of mowers called the "Craftsman" which is basically the same as a "Lawn King" model 45 but finished in Green opposed to Pacific Blue. These had the slightly lower powered engine than the normal "Scott Bonnar" issued machine and also the "Pram" handlebar which is somewhat different to maneuver compared to the standard winged bar assembly, all in all it's just a matter of getting used to that different arrangement.

When you say the mower won't kick over, are you referring to the piston will not travel up and down in the bore or that it just won't start ?

Cheers,
BB.

Hi BB,

Thanks for replying! It just won't start. I haven't had a chance to even clean it properly, so I'll be doing that and replacing oil, fuel, air filter and spark plug this weekend to see if I can get it going. The guy I bought it from just said it's been in storage for about a year, but was running well prior to that.

What are your thoughts on the reel, chain and sprockets? Can I get by with the originals, or do you think I may need to replace some of these parts? Once I get it going, I'll start taking it apart and degreasing everything and start the prep for painting/reassembly.

Thanks again for the welcome

Hello emk3,

I feel that it will more than likely be the plug that's defunct or carby issues. I just love what people say when they are selling something, the lame excuses and cop outs are just a whole bunch of cliches, a bit like a footy coach in the post match presso when they lost.

As far as the sprockets etc. are concerned it looks as if the main powertrain chain and sprockets have seen better days. This is the one coming from the top small sprocket on the PTO (power take off) shaft. The other one being the land roll clutch chain looks not to be in too badder condition. Lets put it this way, I've seen much worse and yours will carry one for a few years yet. Cost is a major factor when deciding how far worn an item is as it's going to inflict pain into the hip pocket.

One thing I would check very thoroughly and that is any signs of rail fatigue around the inner engine mounting bolts. I can't see properly in your photos but it seems there might be some signs there. Can you please give me a close up photo of the two rail mounting points which are on the inner side of the engine and not the outer ones which are nearer the side plate of the chassis.

You'll reel has plenty of life left on it as far as a regrind is concerned but I'd say the bed knife will require replacement. If you could tilt the mower back on it's handlebar and take a couple of close up shots of the leading edge of the bed knife so that I can assess it and advise you best.

Cheers,
BB.

Hello again BB,

thanks for that advice. I think I'll use what is here unless it absolutely need replacing in the near future just to save on cost. So, I'll keep the chain and sprockets as they are. I'll take a photo of the engine mount and bed knife once it's all clean on the weekend.

I picked up the air filters, oil, spark plugs and carby cleaner this afternoon, so hopefully I can get it started this weekend after I've cleaned it up a bit. The air filter in it was so brittle that it fell apart when I went to inspect it.



Now, I've had a look at past topics and other forums and I can't seem to get a straight answer - can I use a degreaser on the mower as is and then wash it down with a pressure washer/gerni or will that do damage to the motor? There are conflicting arguments, so I thought I'd ask here.

Thanks,
emk3

Hi again,

Honestly on the engine I use degreaser in a pressure pack can and flush most of the gunk away solely with the pressure that comes out of the can.

Then I use my hose with a nozzle on the very finest fan setting and lightly flush the degreaser off and then blow it off with compressed air. That's fine on a Briggs and Stratton horizontal shaft engine.

Don't aim direct water into the flywheel area of the engine as that's where the ignition components sit right behind

Cheers,
BB.

Update - I've just cleaned it up enough to read the numbers stamped on the motor:
80 102 0233-01 77042201

Engine was produced on the 22nd of May 1977 which tells me either the engine has been changed at some point or the Air cowling has been substituted due to the starter assembly failing.

The colour of the machine tells me it was built prior to the end of 1976 when SB changed it's colour scheme from Alpine Green to Apple Green.

Cheers,
BB.

Hi,

I'm no expert on engine model numbers etc but I THINK you mean April? (Unless I'm reading the wrong part of the number?) I only say because I can never remember on a briggs what numbers mean what.

Thanks,
Pete.

Hello emk3
A warm welcome to these forums.

I would like to express our policy here: it is gender neutral.
WE are not into 'mansplaining': https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Mansplaining

It is universally true that mower collecting, repairing, and restoring
are, traditionally, 'men's business. It shouldn't be that way!
Evidence suggests there is equal enjoyment from gardening and mowing
for the variety of sexes and gender.

It is important you have basic mechanical aptitude for advice to be given
and understood. If you feel confident in that, then Mods and Members
will offer all assistance needed - regardless of gender.

Having said that, the Crafstman is a version of the famous Model 45.
This is a great project for any 'newbie' to take on board, and it
can deliver great satisfaction in preserving Australia's greatest reel mower.

All the best in this project.
---------------------------------
Jack

right on the head there mr socks , bb was soooo close though .

a lot have a problem figuring out B+S id's though

the only real worry is water ingress . so just be carefull and put no pressure around the carb or as BB said behind or under the flywheel . or an easy fix is just change it from points to later model ignition . no more water problems , but it depends on how orig' you like to keep the machines .

Hi all,

I was just testing to see if anyone was waiting to see me trip up.

I knew someone would take the bait.

Yes it should've read April and I should've known better as my birthday is in May, how many times have I written the 5th. and not the 4th. ???

Cheers,
BB.

i was wrong once too if i remember hahahaha . goodonya BB .

we need a like button here huh , saves time

Hi all,

I've just come in as I've run out of daylight. No luck getting it started. There is no spark with a brand new spark plug, air filter, oil ad petrol. I had a quick look at the coil and there's all sorts of gunk in there. Going to spend some time taking the motor off and apart and cleaning everything before reassembling. Will let you know if that manages to get a spark, otherwise might need to replace the coil? I guess I'll have to take it all apart at some stage and the gunk is so thick and black, so I can't actually see much until I clean it anyway..

In other news, I picked up the second mower today. It is 3 years older and the motor is running really well. The reel has a piece snapped off, so I think I'll just replace and upgrade that. I'll post photos at some stage, but the decals are a bit confusing - it has the briggs and stratton white decals and then also an orange one that looks more like the Kirby decals on the front. Someone has also painted bits and pieces of it along the way because it's not the same hammertone green in some places.

Does anyone have any advice regarding paint colours?
I was thinking the chevy orange for engine and reel, but not too sure on the green? I can't find many shades of green hammertoe out there and I don't really want to spend too much $$ on colour matching...

ebay is a good place for decals . another member here makes and sells on there , silensmessor i think is his ebay name . just type in scott bonnar decals and it should be there .
might like to pop off the flywheel and clean n reset the points before you pull it down just to be sure , or just replace the coil with a later model , then no more points to worry you .

also service the starter clutch while you have off the cover then its done and wont squeal

A few more photos of parts of the engine, clutch, engine mounts and also the bed knife..
Please leave your advice.








I'm also thinking of just changing to electronic ignition as I might end up saving myself some time in the long run with trying to figure out the spark issue...Is anyone able to point me in the right direction in terms of parts that are cheap/2nd hand?

Hi all,

Your mower's chassis is good with no signs of stress fractures, something which is so common on the Series II Model 45.

I have to agree with member "vccom's" comment regarding the checking of the points which are behind the flywheel. Many times these get stuck in conjunction with the plunger which operates them from the crankshaft, thus no spark. The system is reasonably goof proof.

Your reel will go a few more sharpenings but I feel your bed knife won't go another round, especially in the centre area, thus a new one will be required.

Don't attempt to undo the screws securing it to the sole plate as you should just take out the whole sole plate assembly and take it along with your reel to the engineer of your choice. Being that you are in Queensland please don't ask me who to take it to as I don't know anyone in that neck of the woods so to speak.

As far as paint is concerned I get the feeling you're not trying to do a concourse restoration so I would just be using Chevy Orange for the Engine, Signal Red on the reel and leave you to choose the chassis hammertone colour. BTW there aren't many colours available in Hammertone as stock colours, thus if you wanted exactly the same you'd have to take the chain case to a paint centre and get them to colour match it to the inside part of the chain case as that's the most unseen by sunlight part of the machine, apart from the undersides of the chassis rails I guess. It's your call.

Cheers,
BB.

Hi All,

Thanks for the advice. I've called a bunch of paint centres and they don't do any colour matching for hammertone. I got hold of one company that stock cans of the Wattle Olive Green:
What are your thoughts on this colour? Otherwise, what's the closest over the counter spray can I can get?

I've got access to a sandblaster at work, so I'll be sandblasting most parts prior to painting. Can anyone recommend a good primer to use?

** UPDATE ** My Uncle came through for me and put me on to a paint specialist who can match the hammertone and also supply little aerosol bottles for me to pour the paint into. Will go and get it matched this Saturday morning. Winning.

Sounds good, I'm looking forward to seeing some items freshly painted in the genuine colour. Yes you are correct that many places just don't have the personnel with the expertise to colour match nowadays.

When you say sandblasting I hope you don't end up with a really rough (coarse) finish on the metal. Bead blasting is probably the best or a very fine grade grit if standard style blasting.

Honestly a good etch primer is the best way to go.

Cheers,
BB.

Thanks for the advice, BB!
So, I cleaned the chain cases this afternoon and to my eye, they look a slightly different colour:

Which one should I take to be matched? They are both the same model no. Mower 1 is Mower no. 02061 and Mower 2 is mower no. 00348. So, would I take Mower 1 because it's 'newer'?

While I've brought Mower 2 into the discussion (sorry to confuse), the number on the Briggs & Stratton motor is 80102 0233-01 74101701. So, it was manufactured on the 17th Oct 1974? Would you consider this the original motor for this mower?





Please leave your advice regarding chains, sprockets, bed knife, etc. I will have to replace the reel ($$$) as there is a part of one blade that has snapped off. Can anyone point me in the direction of an affordable reel for sale? I'll check engine mounts tomorrow.

Am I right in saying that the rear roller and cylinder cutter bearings should be replaced while I am doing this? Is there anything else that is considered a 'must' to replace/service while I have everything apart in the coming weeks?

Hi emk,

Good ol' flash photography, it never gives the best representation of a colour at the best of times and also if there's one thing we've discovered over the years and that was the Scott Bonnar colour of Alpine Green was never 100% consistant over it's lifetime.

If you look at the distant photos you've taken the machines look far darker than the close up shot of both chain case interiors. This is the flash washing out the colour due to flash bounce.

My choice would be to choose the darker one as its closer to what most SB's are.

The sprockets on the second machine look better than the other machine to be truthful but they are pretty much of a muchness.

The engine number corrolates to the date you've suggested and also suggests that it's more than likely the original power plant for that mower.

If you are doing a total tear down I would most definitely replace all bearings as it's easier to do while it's all apart that have to revisit and worn bearing 6 months later.

Actually that bed knife looks really good and should lick up well by a competent machinist, but as far as the reel is concerned a new one will rather hurtfull on the wallet. I'd keep my eyes open for a rather flogged machine on Gumtree that's full of stree fractures and then take the reel out of that and salvage what else is good, then scrap the rest. I know that doesn't sound the best but it's the cold hard reality of life nowadays. Something must die for something else to live on.

Cheers,
BB.

Good news - I got it going! Converted to magnetron ignition and gave everything a bit of a service/clean out. Will spend more time on it over the weekend to fine tune some things and then will continue with the takedown of the motor and mower parts prior to cleaning and painting.
Pretty happy with my efforts, but I haven't had it running for any length of time and I haven't engaged clutch yet either....Hopefully everything works out this weekend so there are no other major hurdles.

The only thing I found odd - the mower only started when I left the choke in. When I bought the mower, the owner specifically said the choke needed to be pulled out to start and then pushed back in to continue running. This is the same for the second mower I bought. Can anyone justify this?

Hi Guys,

I stopped in at a local bike shop today and they're going to sort out new throttle cables for me made from a brake cable...I don't want to go to a plastic throttle assembly.

I'm also ordering some decals...which chain case matches these machines?

Hi emk,

Check out my Avatar and you'll see how yours should look.

Just a quick one on the throttle cable, they are much thinner on the inner opposed to a brake cable which is the same thickness to your landroll clutch cable.

Cheers,
BB.

Thanks BB,

I'l get onto those ASAP. My $5 throttle cables seem to have worked! I ran the mower (that had no spark) for half an hour or so and cut some of the lawn here. Currently staying with the in-laws while our house is built and they're on acreage, so I certainly wasn't going to mow their whole place...

I have a dilemma - I bought a 3rd SB45 for the reel and picked it up today, but I know I'm going to struggle to just scrap it...so I'm thinking of restoring a 3rd later on and just buy a new reel for ourselves in a year or so..

Of the three, if all engine mounting points, etc are all in good condition, which would you suggest is the best to keep for myself?


From L-R, engines are 1974, 1975 & 1977.
From L-R, model numbers are 450810, 450423 & 450810.

I guess what I'm struggling with is what are the pros and cons of each mower... Does anyone have any advice? Please ignore the missing chain cases and air cowling. I just didn't have them on for the photo.

Hi Em,

It's a bit of a disease isn't it.

It's a no brainer regarding which one, left, right or centre. I'd take the bullseye. But only as I dislike the pram bars.

Am I correct in saying the centre one has a 2.5 HP power plant on it ?



Cheers,
BB.

It really is, BB! If only work didn't get in the way of spending every waking minute on them...Ha!

Yes, it is a 2.5 HP...60102 0347-01 75060503. I was thinking this might be the one to keep for myself as well. The first one to work on will be the Craftsman on the right with the 1977 motor. This is the one that I plan on having done by Christmas for Dad.

Do you have any advice for preparing and repainting the engine? Some advice has been to paint it assembled and other advice has been to remove as many parts as I can to repaint separately. How did you go about yours? Which is the closest to original engine colour - chevy orange or International? I'm guessing signal red is for the reel and sole plate? I want the final product to be as close to original as possible. I'm also getting Craftsman stickers done up for the catcher so that they remain identifiable in the future.

Hi Em,

It's the black chain case and handle bar shield that was the give away as that was the transition livery when Scott Bonnar did their last Kirby powered machines and swapped over to the full Briggs line up of power plants across the full range of mowers.

The Craftsman was a "Store line" mower, by that I mean that it was made as a budget machine exclusively for particular hardware outlets. Basically like a "Walmart" special in the USA.

Ah........ painting engines, it's a bugger of a job at the best of times. It's not the painting that's hard, rather the preparation that's infuriating as there are so many nooks and crannies that hold flaking paint etc. etc. etc. I've always used a bit of paint stripper that you can purchase at your local automotive store, eg. Autobarn, Supercheap etc. and just apply and clean off and keep repeating the process with small wire brushes and screwdriver blades to remove all the dead paint.

If you have the engine in pieces I would do it piece by piece and then assemble it after you've painted the components and then once it's all back together give it a final coat to cover up all the parts where you've knocked off fresh paint like the bolt heads. don't aim too much at the carby as that will only act as a glue over the smaller moving parts.

Paint colour ? International Orange it is for me.

Cheers,
BB.

Hi again Em,

Just a quick one regarding the signal red, that's for the reel only as the sole plate is generally painted in the same colour as the chassis and associated sheetmetal body items.

Cheers,
BB.