I am thinking of removing everything from the steel base of my Victa Powertorque mower for a good clean up and maybe some new paint.
I have worked on my older full crank Victa years ago and I remember there is a slot or hole near the flywheel area on these engines where you can stick a screwdriver in there to stop the crankshaft from turning so you can tighten up or remove the bottom blade carrier nut.
I have never worked on a powertorque engine before. I think I will be able to loosen the blade carrier nut by holding the blade carrier. But I think when the blade carrier nut loosens a bit the blade carrier will then spin around and I will need to somehow stop the crank from turning to be able to remove the nut completely from the bottom. It's quite rusted and seized up I don't even think I can get a socket or spanner on it. It's going to be fun and games getting the nut off. I will probably have to resort to vice grips or something. Oh well I hope it goes well.
Do these powertorque engines have a similar spot or somewhere to lock the crankshaft to make blade carrier nut removal and installation easier like the full cranks do?
Please any help would be much appreciated.
Cheers!
Zip a dee doo dah, zip a dee ay, another trash picked Victa, hip hip Hooray!
They can be a shocker to get off, sometimes before I got my super strong rattle gun (my old one didn't have enough grunt for some of them) if I got stuck with one I would cut the nut parallel to the thread on 4 sides and then the gun could get them off. No such trouble with the double impact gun. Depending on how far away your are if you bring it over I can get it off for you no problems.
I have read some older posts of yours and I think you are around the Dandy area. I am pretty much right across the other side of town in the Preston area mate.
I do have a rattle gun somewhere here but I haven't used it in years. The problem is the nut has rusted and it's breaking away where you would put a socket on it. Even with a rattle gun and socket there is nothing for it to grip to anymore.
I will try WD-40 soaking, vice grips, knocking it with a hammer a bit to see if it starts to move. As long as the thread stays good on the shaft I can then get a new washer and nut. But if the thread goes on the shaft then it's buggered, i'll probably just strip the good parts off the mower and engine and put them away if that happens.
Cheers!
Zip a dee doo dah, zip a dee ay, another trash picked Victa, hip hip Hooray!
Plenty of penetrene, give it some time to soak in. I’ve used a piece of wood to jam between the blade plate and the deck. A good fitting socket and breaker bar, or socket and wrench and a few hits with a rubber mallet. Rattle gun would be nice though.
Another trick to stop the crank shaft is sash cord down the plug hole, but I discarded that after getting a rattle gun. Also try cleaning the retaining nut as much as you can with a wire brush so you can better assess the true shape of it.
Ahh, if only victa had kept producing the thumblatch catcher series, they would be in better shape today!
I have worried about this from time to time but always got it off somehow. You can lock the crankshaft by putting something through the fins of the flywheel. Youtube videos showed a piece of wood. Problem here is that puts all the torque on to the flywheel to crankshaft joint. Its only alloy located by a flattened section on the shaft, no keyway. I have damaged the flywheel like that, not while getting the blade nut off but when torquing up the blade nut when refitting. Not much risk when removing though as its usually pretty much rusted on. Once I locked the shaft by taking the starter off the top and putting a piece of wood between the conrod and the shaft. Worked fine, no damage but refitting not removing.
The PT's are difficult to lock, not like a full crank which at least has the nut on the top.
Norm, I have never had a rattle gun & do not have any idea about them. Bunnings have "impact wrenches" quite cheaply. What do you have, might give me something to go on? Do you still have to lock the shaft?
Yes Converse, I'm in Hampton Park, bit of a drive but not too bad on the weekends, and if it prevents you from damaging a crank then it is worth the effort. Hi Jeff, I have air rattle guns, not sure what the Bunnings ones are. The new one I got a few months ago was a bit over $100 on ebay and it is an 1150nm one, boy does that move nuts. You just hold the blade carrier in your hand and the nut is off in a couple of seconds, the old gun would sit and hammer away and sometimes it just wouldn't look like moving them. No penetrene needed with this method.Nuts I couldn't get off I used to cut with the grinder, but I got sick of that idea. Took me a while to justify the expense but I couldn't go back now. Jeff I just had a look at the Bunnings ones but they are cost prohibitive for what you want to do. If you don't have a compressor, you could buy one and a an air gun for that sort of money
Top photo is my 20v battery powered rattle gun. It has done the job well (though loudly) on a few mowers. Don't know how well it would do a badly rusted on one.
The set below is for removing lug nuts and runs off the cigarette lighter or directly off a car battery. It has got me out of trouble in the past with a Victa utility that had been semi exposed to the elements, where my (admittedly cheap) air gun running off a 2hp compressor wouldn't move it.
Ahh, if only victa had kept producing the thumblatch catcher series, they would be in better shape today!
G'day everyone and thanks again for all the help, I took all advise and tips onboard when I did this today, great news is the nut is off and the thread on the shaft is ok!
Now for the nitty gritty on what I went through to get that bugger off! lol
First I tried soaking in WD-40. I used a block of wood wedged against the blade carrier and the deck, worked really well blade carrier wasn't going to turn anywhere.
I then tried a spanner, nope the nut end is rusted and not really enough to grip to. I then tried a socket on it with a breaker bar and extension. Nope that damn bugger woundn't budge. Also the socket was slipping off the nut because the nut was buggered, can't get a good grip on it like a new one.
Then I resorted to vice grips, you know when you get to this point you are running out of options...lol Damn I had the vice grips on that nut and I was hitting the vice grips with a peice of wood and a brick. The vice grips were just turning and stripping the metal off the nut and it never budged. Now I had a nut that was nearly rounded and seized on.
At this point in time i'm thinking I will have to resort to what NormK said and end up cutting the bugger off with an angle grinder. But I thought I won't do that until I at least try a rattle gun, as I knew I had one somewhere in the shed.
I have an air type rattle gun that I bought from Super Cheap Auto about 10 years ago now. I quickly checked the box and it's says it's a twin hammer type and about 560nm of torque.
I used a tube socket from a cheap set that I have as I knew it may get damaged trying to remove this nut. I hammered the best fitting socket onto the nut with a brick to get the best grip possible, because the nut hasn't got much left on it.
Then I hoped for the best and started the rattle gun, you little ripper! As soon as I hit that smashed on socket with the rattle gun the nut started turning and was off in about 5 seconds!
The thread on the shaft is also fine. It's great as I can keep working on this mower now. Awesome!
Just another question about putting a new nut back on, I have heard that it's not a good idea to put these nuts back on with a rattle gun as it's got too much torque and it might get threaded?
Any tips on putting these nuts back on a powertorque engine?
I have noticed on these powertorque engines, there is large sort of disc that turns near the bottom of the engine next to the steel deck? Maybe something could be put near this at the bottom to stop it turning to put a new blade carrier nut on? I'm not sure. Then i'm thinking I won't be removing the steel boss that sits on the shaft behind the blade carrier, this should also be seized on...haha. Maybe I can get some vice grips onto this from behind the blade carrier to stop the crank from turning while doing up the nut. Either way it's probably not as hard as it was getting the old rusted bugger off! LOL!
Cheers and thanks again everyone for all the help it's great!
Last edited by Converse; 11/02/1905:09 PM.
Zip a dee doo dah, zip a dee ay, another trash picked Victa, hip hip Hooray!
Jeff, 2 hp is enough it isn't like you are spray painting and the double hammer type is needed, just watch ebay and you will find one. Converse, the turning disc is the flywheel/fan and to remove the boss, hold a big hammer on one side and give the opposite side a couple of good hits with another hammer and it will pop off, it is on a taper. I fit the blade carriers back on using my 320nm gun and I don't have any problems and you just hold the carrier in your hand. They need to be tight but not over tight
1150nm. That's Sherman Tank territory!! I'm amazed it doesn't sheer off the 1/2" drive end. Is it 3/4 dr? I know of someone who did just that trying to remove the front axle nut off a 1990s Volvo with a 1/2" breaker bar. I don't know why the Europeans insist on high torque specs with their vehicles.
Ahh, if only victa had kept producing the thumblatch catcher series, they would be in better shape today!
Hi Jeff, and anyone else out there having trouble...
I bought a $169 Ryobi One+ impact wrench for use mainly on our cars. I didn't specifically pick the One+ ecosystem, it seems I have just ended up that way! All I was initially chasing was a small workshop blower with a rubber tip for use with detailing the cars...
Anyway, the wrench has been priceless on mower blade carrier nuts. Only needed it dialed up to 2/3 to get some seriously rusted nuts off in a jiffy. I was super skeptical of it, as it can't compare to decent air jobbies, but I didn't fancy spending big on a new compressor.
Converse, I usually set my impact wrench to 1/3 power and then release as soon as I feel it kick. I then get the torque wrench out and finish the job with a block of wood jamming the carrier. Haven't managed to over torque a nut this way yet. Funnily enough, I have seen mention in a repair manual for powertorques of a place where you can stick a steel pole into the shaft to stop it spinning...but I can't for the life of me figure out where it is, exactly!!
I don't collect mowers. I just require Multiple Mowing Solutionsâ„¢.
Hi, Most PT blade disc bosses have a hole in them, I guess its for that steel bar. Even holding the blade boss still puts strain on that flywheel to crankshaft joint. Its only alloy sort of Dshaped with a flattened area to locate the flywheel. No key way. As I said I damaged one once putting it on. Not sure if the nut was on too loose or what but it put the timing out. Rattle gun is sounding better and better.
G'day everyone and thanks for all the help with this it's great!
I think what we have found here is there is probably nothing better or easier than to use a rattle gun to remove those darn sometimes rusted, seized and hard to get off blade carrier nuts.
Thanks again everyone, I will also use all the advise here for installing a new nut and washer for the blade carrier with the powertorque engine.
Cheers!
Zip a dee doo dah, zip a dee ay, another trash picked Victa, hip hip Hooray!
I just went to remove the blade bar off a Lawn Beetle, and my old gun would not look at it, and I had a full tank of air. Double bang gun just walked it out
Just another question about putting a new nut back on, I have heard that it's not a good idea to put these nuts back on with a rattle gun as it's got too much torque and it might get threaded?
Hi Converse,
I was looking through the old posts and came across this one, and literally just had to put a disc back on. I used a Torsion Bar. Torsion bars are made of Chrome Molybdenum and are designed to withstand the force of impact wrenches. The thickness of the Torsion Bar will dictate the tightening torque it will allow. The thinnest bar in the set I have is 75NM. So once the nut is tightened to 75NM, rather than continue to tighten, the bar wobbles and flexes. Please note, most impact compatible tools should be made from materials like Chrome Molybdenum. Chrome Vanadium is not as resistant to shattering and should not be used.
I'd also like to add as a side note to anyone who may be reading this, use 6PT sockets/wrenches where possible, not 12PT. When I was younger I was told how fandangle and amazing 12PT was, but over the years I've come to realise that they can be your worst nightmare haha.
For anyone who comes across this thread and is still stuck at the end of it, where you may be able to fit the tool, you can use Nut Splitters which could remove the nut, and you can also try rounded nut removers (Though you may struggle to find one designed for nuts that are 24/25mm).
In a pinch, you can try to re-grind 2 or more flat sides so you can get some sort of spanner on there to try to remove the nut.
Finally, please be careful using impact tools. When you're trying to remove a stuck bolt they can be a godsend, but if you're using an impact wrench that can tighten over the specified torque of the bolt in question, you're at very high risk of overtightening. A mechanic used a 1000NM wrench when putting the wheels back on my car. When I tried to get them off, the nut stripped and the mechanic had to drill out the stud. Remember, both the fastener and the thread are only designed to withstand a specific amount of torque, and overtightening a component which is connected to another component can lead to all sorts of issues down the track. Where possible, torque wrenches and other devices like Torsion Bars should be used. Also remember, many impact wrenches will reach their peak torque after a period of time or number of impacts, so letting the tool run until it clicks once or twice to try to be safe may result in looser than required fasteners, but similarly, some will provide the full force (Or close to it) earlier on, so waiting for a couple of impacts and stopping could have already resulted in overtightening.
