OutdoorKing Repair Forum Forums Repairs and Maintenance Questions on Engines Questions On Honda Engines Fuel Tank for Honda G400 needed please

Hi All
I am trying to help out my daughter and young family who live near Ipswich. Although their house was not flooded they were surrounded by water and their power was cut off for safety.So they were forced to evacuate to my house which was a bit hairy on the flooded roads.
All is now well but to avoid the situation arising again I have bought an old Honda G400 side valve 10hp coupled to a Dunlite 5kva generator. This was a stored non runner which I have now running fine. However it needs a new muffler,which I am happy to buy from Honda (unless anyone on the Forum has one for sale) but more importantly it needs a new petrol tank.
The original tank has been replaced and the one currently fitted holds little more than a teacup, plus there is no fuel stopcock assy. I attach pic of fitting - there is an engine bracket to which one side of the tank bolts so really I could adapt the bracket to take many Honda tanks I would have thought if a G400 or G300 was not available (as long as the tank has protruding threaded studs). I dont want to shell out $130 on a new one (I have to buy the muffler as well) so if anyone has a 2nd hand tank for reasonable money plus postage I will be most grateful. I am in Qld 4520.
I will try to upload a pic of the old muffler as well - it has a big rust hole in it. I didn't realise it was so bad as it was covered by a chromed heat guard. Ho hum.

pic of muffler

Theres a guy on eBay that has a G200 tank.

Im thinking i will buy the rest of the motor off him, mine had a rusty flywheel. I dont think the reduction drive off it will fit on the GX140

Heres a pic of mine.



Rough idea of the measurments.


This is the muffler on the G65.

I was just thinking that the main pipe that goes in, if i hack off the rusted box i could slip a briggs/cheap muffler over the end and weld it on. Reason being that a Honda muffler was over $150.


Cheers, Bob.

Hi Bob,
Thanks for your reply. Sorry, I am not quite clear what you are recommending - are you saying I should buy the G200 tank off ebay or are you offering me your tank that you picture to buy.Is yours a G200 tank?

As to mufflers, I have had the disappointment of finding that muffler for G400 has been discontinued so I am looking at same solution as you. Sadly I don't have welder so I will have to pay a muffler shop to weld my manifold to a new similar box. I would have liked to re-use my chrome heat shield which bolts to the Honda muffler but that looks like a lost cause now.

All the best
Brian

I was suggesting the tank on eBay. Mine is for a reference to see if it will go close to fitting. Bolt spacing and fuel tap location.


Thats what has been done to my G200. It has had a long Briggs muffler welded to the pipe/manifold. I did not think to take a picture of it, i took one of the G65 as i had to move it out from under the bench to get the G200 out.


Bob.

Thanks Bob,
I have bought the ebay G200 tank - hopefully it will arrive soon. Should sort me out, so thanks for measurements.

Sounds like you would recommend adapting a briggs muffler rather than visit an auto muffler shop. I will visit my nearest Briggs store and see what comes close in shape. Might get me to a position where I can bolt on a heat shield again rather than a car hot bare metal scenario. My local 'Macs mufflers ' auto store was talking $130 to adapt/weld a car muffler to my manifold which is getting a bit expensive for a 1/2way solution.

Thanks again for your trouble in taking pics.
regards
brian

The muffler does not need to be very big.

I would also suggest finding someone who has a stack of dead mowers. The tip, scrap metal yard, mower shop, etc.


Some of the later Briggs mufflers (bolt on box shaped ones) could be suitable and have different types of heat shields depending on application. To mount them you would need the tubing from the head to where it needs to sit. Then a flange welded to the tube. Would be easy to make out of a bit of flat plate, hole in the centre and two bolt holes tapped either side for the bolts to hold the muffler on.
Heres one thats for sale in the store on the site here. Suits 4-8HP Briggs.

And theres one that looks pretty slimilar but bigger for the larger motors.


Suziki 2 strokes and also the Tecumseh motors could be another source. Not sure how the 2 stroke one would go. You basically just want something that will either go in your heat shield or comes with its own.

Youve got the idea and the shape of the old one in your head, its just a case of eyballing it and going 'thats the one, i can make it work'


Thats good about the tank. Are they the same mounting bolt pattern???

Cheers, Bob.

Hi Bob,
Many thanks for continued advice.

Tank 1st - G200 tank duly arrived and with a bit of fettling with the mounting bracket, its on and looks right. Slight problem, the orientation is opposite way round so in order for the underneath indentation to sit on the spark plug, the petrol line outlet is opposite side to carby. So the plastic fuel line has to travel under the tank on its way to carby and sit on the red metal plate covering the cylinder head . Thus it gets pretty hot, so I will need to get some heatproof sleeving - I hope it is easily available.

2nd, before spending serious money on adapted muffler and welding I thought I should check the Dunlite generator part over more thoroughly. Got the housing off ok- same story as engine really, not particularly worn, just rusty/ dirty. Especially the slip ring - with a good clean with meths the output is much improved. I think the brushes were sticking as i could only get them out from the inside of the casing. They are square in cross section and one is chipped/damaged. They are on back order at 'Diesel and Machinery Ltd' so if you know of another supplier for my old 5kva Dunlite, please let me know.

Lastly, muffler - I will have look at the B&S box though it will be a bit crowded I think next to the carby.Having said that I see that the muffler tube is offset so the box could be rotated away from the carby. However it might be difficult to find somewhere to bolt the B&S muffler angle bracket to - I dont think this is something you have had to do as earlier in the thread you mentioned fitting a long muffler - I guess these aren't available any more.

All the best
Brian

You could try running the fuel line through another bit of rubber hose thats bigger in diameter.

Or go the long way round.

Im glad you had more luck than i did. I drove all the way to Leongatha to get a G200 flywheel and picked up 2 motors that looked nothing like the G200 ive got. I hope i can make something work with what i go.





I have had very little to do with generators. i would assume that you are working within the confines of a frame/cage/cover and everything needs to sort of stay within that.

The G200 i had here just had the long muffler poking out the side.

So im not sure what sort of confines you are trying to work in.

The mufflers are still available.
Theres three sorts, small long one for up to 4Hp, larger long for up to 8Hp, then another one thats bigger in diamter (sorta trumpet looking) for 5, 7 & 8HP. And another one on a long pipe for 11Hp.

Then theres this one


Might not be big enough as it only for 4Hp.

Then on the ends of them you can put a deflector shield if its pointing at something or just to hush it up a bit more.

Check the store, the link is on the left. Engine parts, Briggs motors, B&S engine parts, Mufflers.

Not sure what mufflers you can get for other motors. Im sure you will be able to make something work.


Bob.

Hi Bob,
As you have been good enough to have so much input, I thought you might like to see the finished product.

My worrying brain had already decided to re-route the plastic fuel line and I managed to get hold of some small bore hose as sleeving. As you csn see I made an add'l bracket to tie the line up to.

The new fuel tank looks pretty good - you can see that it is undersize for the G400 and does not span both the engine brackets which would normally hold it. However my bracket attached to the engine cover plate looks ok and there is minimal vibration. The new tank holds just under a gallon so I am happy with that.

You can see that my muffler problem was fitting it between the air filter and the throttle linkage, still ensuring it was adequately fixed so it wouldn't rattle itself to bits. As I have no welder, I gave in and went to 'Macs mufflers'. They used my old exhaust flange and made up/welded a new muffler (fibreglass wrapped) and brackets. It cost $150 including some repair welding to frame. I think they have done a smart job but its blown the budget a bit. If anyone in Brisbane North would like to be hired to give me mig welding lessons I will jump to it.

The finished article starts first pull, has plenty of compression, runs smoothly with no smoke. I have set the throttle so the generator pushes out a constant 240volt. The whole job owes me about $400 which is pretty good for a 5kva Dunlite generator - I think!?

Many thanks again Bob.

Brian, it's not clear from what you've said, but the engine speed has to be set to give 50 Hertz output, and the voltage takes care of itself (there is a sort of regulator). You may have the engine running at the wrong speed. It has to be 3,000 rpm, plus or minus zero.

Many thanks Grumpy - I had simply placed a voltmeter on the generator output and adjusted throttle speed till I got 240v.

I will endeavour to get a rev counter attached to do the job properly - thanks for putting me right.
regards
brian

Brian, there are several ways you can set the speed. You could use an ordinary electronic engine tachometer on the spark plug lead, but it isn't accurate enough to be especially useful - you need a digital tachometer. I set up a Lister driving an 8.5 kVA generator a few years ago. I began with an ordinary radio frequency digital counter, setting the gate time to ten seconds (as long as it would go) but that gave me a rather variable count. I switched to using a digital stroboscope on the camshaft (crankshaft isn't visible on a Lister - you crank the camshaft) and set the speed to exactly 750 rpm (it was a 4 pole alternator, so the crankshaft had to run at 1500). The Lister had a special optional governor - its whole adjustment range was only about plus or minus 1.5 Hertz. You won't be so lucky, but you should be able to get it to run at 3000 rpm at say 50% load.

Looks good.
Would be a hell of a lot quieter with that muffler on it. Adapting one of the ones i showed it would have been as noisy as a mower.

One of the best things i ever did was go to Tafe and do a course in Arc Welding. Buy an old welder with a plunger in it and a packet of 2mm electrodes and with the Amps down stuff like that can be welded. Not efficently but take it steady and its a good enough job to go the distance.

Cheers, Bob.