OutdoorKing Repair Forum Forums Restoring, Customising and Modifying Engines Points - What is the point? (Pope 320)

Hello all,

Today I removed the flywheel from one of my Pope motors. It currently has no spark.

I've had a look at some information concerning the Victa points system and tried to apply it to the Wipac that is on the Pope, but with no real joy. I've read the Pope manual provided by Jack, but I'd like a few things explained if you could.

1. The flywheel states to set the gap to 0.018. That's good, but what exactly am I gapping? Which bit is the point?
2. The whole assembly is moveable a few mm L and R if you slackened off the two large bolts on the left and right side of it. This must be done for a reason, but what?

No doubt I'll have more questions as this progresses. It is, by sheer luck, the first ever points motor I've pulled apart. Everything else has had E.I!

Pic attached.

Thank you!

Hi Mystyler

To answer your questions:
1 - you gap the points where the red arrow is - should be some resistance when the feeler gauge is pulled through. First, turn the the crankshaft until the cam pushes the points open. Really you should remove them, true up the faces on a stone then wash in petrol, but if they aren't too bad, just use some light sand paper or a points file and wipe with a petrol damped rag.

If the gap needs changing, undo the screw (most likely the one circled, but I am not familiar with this system) and adjust to right gap, hold position and retighten screws.

drip some oil on the felt pad (blue line on right) - to prevent wear to points leg (labelled PL)

2 - that will change the timing - you may now need to retime it. There will either be a 2 marks to align, or you will need to measure the piston so many mm from TDC

I like your new signature by the way

Spot on Tyler.
While you have the flywheel off Mystyler, I'd clean the coil post faces . I just use a small wire wheel on a drill and check the air gap between the flywheel and the coil faces..
The gap usually is right, just needs a clean.
cheers
speedy

And if you want to try something for kicks and giggles try an ignition module on it and see if that works, gets rid of potential points and condenser problems

Tyler and speedy, thank you. It seems the cam is part of the flywheel itself on this thing? I'll have a closer look when I get some more time, but it'll only open the points when it's installed and I've removed the "viewing window" in the flywheel. It's making getting a feeler gauge in a right pain. And this one I'll need to retime "using a piece of cardboard" according to the manual.

It's not a dumb idea norm. I don't have any spares kicking around though. I'd thought about buying one just to try. If it doesn't work, I've got a spare.

Unless you are in a rush just wait till you find another PT in a scrap pile or beside the road and grab the module off it, if it has one that is, or one off a sidepull, but they are a bit harder to come by.

That would explain why I couldn't see an eccentric lobe to push the leg open - and why the leg isn't touching anything whilst static. Why did they choose to put it on the flywheel - what a pain

I can't help myself Norm, I'm sure one will turn up one day, one way or another!



Probably because it is a British design?

Yup Mystyler,
There is the odd British designed item we find difficult to understand how somebody came up with that idea, but that is probably why we like some of the old stuff just because of the stupid designs and the fact we can still get it to work. Sadly this may not be the case in a few generations time, but I guess there will always be somebody wanting to tinker and learn how things used to work

I must say I had an inkling of that being the case haha

The same mob that invent several different thread types, then use a different one on different parts, and invent another for at least 1 bolt on every product. Exaggeration of course, but not far off

It might be stereotypical, but stereotypes exist for a reason!

I had a friend who worked on the Boeing/MD F/A18s and the BAe Hawk trainers for the RAAF. In a nutshell, if you wanted to replace a part:

F/A18:

1. Remove cover.
2. Undo fasteners
3. Slide component out


Hawk:

1. Loosen 11 retaining bolts to reveal access port
2. Insert screwdriver at 90° through access port, which isn't big enough, and remove 9 left handed screws
3. etc....

Only got a few more shifts, then hopefully five days off. Really hope I can get spark.

Incidentally, not only do I need stiff cardboard to set the timing, but a piece of cigarette paper as well.

morning Mystyler,
I found this bit on adjusting Wipac points series 161, it might be helpfull.
https://groups.google.com/forum/#!topic/uk.rec.engines.stationary/GyVPBBLTkxM

I adjusted Wipac on a British Seagul, but it was a different series.
I like to google the unknown..
cheers
speedy

G'day all
A Pope 320 Manual may be found here.

https://www.outdoorking-forum.com.au/forum/ubbthreads.php/topics/101660/pope-rotary-valve-2-stroke-c1957.html

I do not know if this is helpful, but it does cover the
newer style Wipac used on the 320s.

Cheers
----------------------
Jack

Speedy and Jack,

Thank you both. I'm planning to devote some time to it tomorrow.

Flicking through an IPL (thank you Jack) for the various 320s, I think mine actually has an original Pope blade carrier, just one first found on the -15. Fairly sure mine is an -04.

As the light faded with dusk rapidly turning to night, not only did the little Pope give spark, but she fired on Start Ya Bastard down the intake.