OutdoorKing Repair Forum Forums Repairs and Maintenance Questions on Walk Behind Lawn Mower Frames Reel Lawn Mowers, Atco & Villiers etc. Brass flywheel removal - Villiers engine

Help. I've undone the flywheel nut about 3/4's of a turn but it then goes tight. Between fully done up and 3/4's undone it is very free. Am I missing something. Is the nut (which is about 1 1/2" long, with the threads only at the bottom, partially captive within the flywheel? i.e. Should I loosen it then use a puller to break the taper, then continue undoing the nut to draw the flywheel off?

Hi the nut is an built puller so keep undoing it and the flywheel will come off yes it is very tight so you may need to use a breaker bar to move it but it will come off . hope this helps Peter.

Alister,
What Peter said is correct. After you crack the nut it does become hand tight for approx 3/4 of a turn. You just simply keep turning with the device you started with. Just one hint though, when you assemble every thing back together dont over tighten the cranking device ie kick start or rope pull. I did this and at a later date removed the rope start and it brought the flywheel with it. A real cow to get off then. Give me a bell if you have any trouble.

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i know this is an old post but ive come across something i hadnt seen before with a villiers flywheel.
i just picked up an old worn villiers engine. its timing was slightly out. when i went to remove the flywheel i started undoing the nut and the whole nut itself came off. it had been snapped off by the previous owner. i can only assume that when it got to the 2nd sticking point instead of releasing the taper it snapped the nut instead.
my question is how now do i get the flywheel off. i am thinking of using my big puller. its pretty obvious now that ive had a good look at it that its been a problem as there are a lot of damage marks all over the flywheel (i guess from previous attempts of removal)i dont want to add to this.

Hey Gizmo, what type of Villiers engine are you dealing with?

Craig

its a midget mark 2. heres a pic of the flywheel and the nut that has been broken off of the housing.
i am going to remove one of my other villiers to see exactly how they are attached before i do anything. as you can see its impossible to heat it up as it covers the coil etc and i really dont want to damage those as the motor sort of runs (timing is out a bit)and reuse them when i can get it apart . i have another magneto housing to replace it with but i didnt really want to damage this one any further in its removal.

I had a similar engine long ago on a 1249 ATCO, and it was something of a pain in various ways, since it had no keyway between crankshaft and flywheel, so timing was pretty tedious. I normally was able to remove the flywheel just by unscrewing the nut until its flange applied pressure to the flywheel, then tapping the outside of the flywheel with a rubber hammer. However I think with hindsight it would have come off more easily if I'd also used a 3" gear puller, with its center-bolt against the end of the crankshaft inside the nut, and its 3 jaws hooked on the flywheel's central flange. Of course you wouldn't pull really hard with the puller - it is just an aid to the flange of the nut, and the rubber hammer around the outside of the flywheel.

Hello all,

I guess the beauty of this 'imprisoned nut' system is that it did away with
the need for a puller to crack the taper. So, I guess now that it is damaged,
a puller combined with a soft or moderate strike should release the taper.



Hope this helps.
-------------------------------
JACK

Jack, the problem I experienced was that considerable force was needed to pull the flywheel off, and the annulus attached to the flywheel which made the nut captive, was visibly deformed outward where the nut-flange pressed against the back of it. I have seen one of those flywheels with the annulus opened up completely so that the nut escaped. Hence, I think a method is needed for preserving vintage flywheels by easing the load on the annulus. I don't like any axial force being applied to the crankshaft as a whole, but of course a puller attached to the flywheel web itself does not do that.

If it had been a cast iron flywheel I'd have happily (and far more effectively) used a metal hammer on the flywheel rather than a rubber one, but not on a brass or even a steel one, for fear of marking it.

Hello Grumpy

I was not aware your annulus was deformed.
I think the best tip for flywheel removal is that it relies less on
force and more on force + shock - with a soft mallet directly on the spanner.
I personally have never had any problems here. Of course, the crankshaft
should be restrained by some method to maximise the shock loading.

Also, on tightening, the taper should be absolutely clean and be
oil residue free. I have been caught out by that...

In this case, I think a puller combined with shock to the puller
screw (not the flywheel) is the best option. Perhaps, another
member will suggest another method.

Cheers.
----------------------
JACK

well after a considerable amount of effort a 3 hours later. i managed to prize off the taper.
1st i tried my 75mm puller.it fit inside the 3 spokes quite comfortably.i put a huge amount of pressure on it to the point i thought my puller was going to snap. then it did the unthinkable it rotated through past the coil and took a big chunk out of it:(.i hit it time and time again. sharp whacks with my brass hammer. (nothing not a budge).
then comes the big puller.too big to fit inside the wheel. i had only a little pressure on it but it was obvious it was only going to bend the housing and nothing more.after many more attempts i gave up and cut the bugger off. i had to cut through the 3 spokes to remove the housing which left the inner bit.



i was the able to to remove all the inner bits , coil. points. etc. i could now heat it up.
on went the puller again and pressurized to max. i applied heat and heat and heat and pressure and heat etc etc. still no budge.
in the finish i got my grinder and cut slits through it all around.
applied more heat and pressure and with one sharp rap it popped off.
ive never had one this stuck before. just hope i havent damaged my coil.

Ahhhh Im to late! I would have drilled and tapped 3 1/4 24fi threads on the spokes as close to centre as possible (basically where your cut lines are)and used a puller as per the style we use on early Victa fly wheels.

Flys are around so its no biggy, especially since you would have the same issue next time round.

A fair outcome Giz, especially if the internals were saved:)

Ill give you a hand with your Roto shortly Mate:)

i was thinking of getting a piece of round steel plate and bolting the housing back onto that and reusing it.possibly welding the centre to that.it would look just like the cover plate

came across 2 more annoyances with this mower in its progress.also havent had these 2 problems before on the villiers either.
i guess ive been lucky so far that most of the old mowers electrical systems are usually so dirty and poorly connected that all thats needed is a good clean up of everything and reattaching it all back like new.
not on this one though.
it was getting some spark. only weak and erratic. so i thought RIGHT big clean up time. spent saturday cleaning all the bits.put it back together it seemed a lot better.still wouldnt fire up.so i did the usual ,removed spark plug to check 4 spark.very little and erratic still.
ok time to check a few things. most culprits are the coil so i checked its ohms values. low and behold no reading on the high side.
well that solves that. swapped it for a good one. still weak erratic spark. double checked the newer coil its values seems ok.

cant possibly be the condenser its getting spark?? so i had to remove the magneto housing and the points housing.(not as simple as the victas).
pulled out the condenser and checked it for voltage (nothing).
well i must say ive never had both of these bad in one mower before.

after changing the coil and condenser it ran like its supposed to. yippee.

oh by the way has this site been hacked. a lot of jibberish on the previous posts

Hey Giz,

Yeah I've been pretty lucky to...Never had a condenser go, but have had 2 coils failed.

Always check and recheck timing first when youve had the fly off. Check via arrow and TDC as I've had a false mark before and a few unmarked.

Make sure you always change the lead(as they are often green right through) Most early car leads work well and are the right diameter. And ensure that the screw goes in square and spring has good tension.

Occasionaly the pin doesnt hit on the coil point when its screwed in to, sometimes the felt has been replaced with something thicker, and Ive even had the coil contact below the outer casing!

Also, NEVER forget the fibre contact washer when you strip the points assy, Yup I've dropped it a few times and scratched my head for an hour as to why it wouldn't spark after Id rebuilt everything...DoH! Lols.

If you can get the coil mounts off the ends, sometimes the poles are just a mass of rust oil and moisture and can hinder contact.


Anyways, glad you got her chugging...they are really good engine to play with.

As for site hack, dunno...If its one of my posts, its sure to have heaps of Gibberish! Lols.