OutdoorKing Repair Forum Forums General Discussion Forum Events - Past & Present VICTA - Final 2-Stroke Models Announced

G'day all

I guess some collectors will consider a final purchase of a Victa 2-stroke model.
The Brunswick Green in the Aussie Range will probably be popular.

I also guess some collectors will buy a cartoned machine, and keep it that way.

Whatever the case, the Victa 2-stroke is about to meet its maker -
it will be, shortly, no more on the great Australian landscape.

------------------------
Jack

A few weeks ago I convinced a mate who mows back yards that are big and get fairly long, to chase up an old Victa 24 with a full crank motor and pre plastic carb. He whinged about paying nearly $300 for one but now it is his mower of choice. He wanted to know why they were still so expensive, my answer was "because they work and do the job you ask them to do and people know that"

Why have I rarely, if ever, seen 2 strokes in a mower man's trailer or ute?
One time a four stroke mower freak that mowed part time claimed four strokes have more torque when I said Victas had plenty of torque.
My mate who only uses four strokes, used a neighbour's recent build Victa 2 stroke to do his lawn and was impressed by it's performance and commented that the governor worked well as the engine revs never lowered as it chewed through the tough patches of grass. ( only about 10cm tall in this case).

And the really smart people will hang onto the boxes the new mowers come in, because we all know what sort of money the old toe cutter boxes sell for these days

Mowerfreak, I think one of the reasons you don't see 2 strokes in mower mens trailers is because as I explained to my mate, they run around mowing lawns on a regular basis, so the lawns never get long and that is what the 4 stroke likes, mowing lawns. My mate has 2 Honda self propelled but he breaks the gearboxes in them because he expects them to buldoze through long grass. The motors are plenty strong enough, far stronger than the gearbox can handle but they are designed for mowing lawns, not jungle

Morning all,

Thanks for the link Gadge. I get the distinct impression we are going to have a rubber stamp of the U.S. EPA standards in this country. 2018 is not far away.

Perhaps the decision to axe the 2 stroke has less to do with scotching the old Aussie competitor and more to do with dropping sales and the impending emissions standards. Let's face it, if the wanted to do away with it because it was a competitor they have had since 2008 to do it. Almost nine years.

Reality is that sales figures for them are dropping. And that'll have a lot to do with the cost per unit of the new range. The volume isn't there. And with emission standards coming....

Just a theory.

Cheers,

G'day all.
prd, I feel that your view is closer to the truth - vis-a-vis the link Glo Mod Gadge gave us.
I think AUS will rubber stamp it, as you say...

Yes, I think so too. Remember that B&S radically changed its structure
in the 1980s - to become a maker of end products in its own right. I
mean, Honda showed that an OEM engine maker could still do so comfortably,
and also be an equipment makers as well.

The old view, that if an engine maker began to make end products (like mowers)
then this would significantly undermine sales of their engines to competitor
end product makers has proved unfounded.

The second point I feel is worth making is that Victa 2-strokes have not sold
in Europe for a long time, and never found any market in the USA. For Briggs
to continue with the Victa 2-stroke (not a world-class engine) makes no sense
to me. Having said that, it could also be argued that the EPA standards were
a convenient excuse to end 2-stroke production...

Yes, but with some equivocation. It is true that markets accepting the 2-stroke
have greatly reduced - with them being sold here and in NZ. But, Briggs
clear promotion of its own 4-strokes was pretty clear; with the
vast majority of models being 4-stroke models. In other words, Briggs,
itself, has contributed to the decline of popularity of the 2-stroke.

I do believe that it is on record that Briggs could have developed the
2-stroke to comply with the new EPA standards, but it decided it was not
cost-effective (however that may be interpreted).

For the record, it could be argued that Victa ceased being 'Australian'
when it joined the giant ([American] Sunbeam Corporation in 1970.
Under new ownership, Victa produced some of the best rotaries ever
made (and so un-American), and I mean here the famous VCs. But at
this time, Victa also (in pro-American fashion) adopted a global
approach, importing and locally assembling imported designs and machines,
as well as local manufacture of the main product lines.

Victa wanted to be not just a mower maker but a garden products
company; as importer, exporter and local manufacturer. It was
a grand design! But by becoming so, Victa opened up and presented
itself to the world ... and potential takeover.

Interesting discussion so far...
Thanks to all contributors for spicing-up the forums.
I feel it is warranted here; because the demise of the 2-stroke is,
arguably, the single most unique feature Victa had in its history, from
and including the Model 1.

All that remain after this year will be the memories and ...
just another brand name ... 'Victa' [just like 'Scott Bonnar'].

All very interesting.
-----------------------------
Jack

Morning Jack,

All very valid points well made.

Completely agree that emission standards may be a 'convenient' out but I can't help wondering what came first, the chicken or the egg? Did they make the decision not to upgrade to EPA standards for the U.S. and European markets because the market was already declining or the decision not to upgrade the reason for the decline (complete closure) of these markets?

And to what extent is/ was there tariff protection working against the import of the Australian made engine into the U.S.? I really have no idea what the answer is on that one. I'm just kicking the can around.

Ultimately a sale of a 2st engine is a profit for B&S just as much as the sale of a 4st.

Consumers are funny cattle. Price aside, the decision to buy 4st for most of them will, I suggest, be based on the 'hassle' of mixing fuel (despite the fact that most of them will have mixed fuel for the weed eater anyway(!) as was previously mentioned) and the perception of hard starting. Consumer prejudice is a tough battle but it can be changed with strong clever marketing, time, and the effort of knowledgeable sales people. Of course the parent company needs to be sufficiently committed to the product to bother.

Just kicking the can around.

Cheers,

I think another thing that has put people off the Victa is the silly faults they built into the LM carby, people just got sick of them giving trouble and the next mower they would buy was a 4 stroke

G'day prd
I ask myself that every second Tuesday of every month.
... I still don't know.

That, I feel, is an important point ...
Americans remain protectionists ... and more so in desiring to 'make America
great again.' I am a firm believer in tariff protections. I do not know
what part tariffs played in preventing Victa to enter the USA market.

Perhaps this reflects the complexity of commercial and
political interests. It appears 'true' that 2-strokes can be
made compliant - with sophisticated fuel injection and the like.
I don't know if this is economical for small lawnmower engines.
I'm glad you raised the issue though.


Yes, this explains my behaviour on every second Tuesday of every month!
I guess this is about economies of scale and World markets.


I would think this is as wise a statement as has ever been written
on these great forums, prd. I can't top that one. The history of lawnmowers
has always been about making life (style) easier.

Many thanks for kicking the can around.

All very interesting,
----------------------------
Jack

Cheers Jack.

And of course that's 'price' not 'pride'

.......and yes, my comments are to be read on the assumption that emission standards compliance is cost effective.

mixing two stroke fuel also killed the victa
now days people two lazy or dumb to mix two stroke
we even had one ruined victa two stroke come in the shop after being run on mixture of petrol and sealsol fertiliser as the plastic bottle it comes in is the same as the ones two stroke oil comes in with the 200ml mixing chamber
the silly house wife grabed the wrong bottle and added the sealsol to fuel mix what can I say
I wonder how many victa two strokes have destroyed been destroyed by wrong fuel mix

Think of how many have been destroyed by just putting straight petrol in with NO 2 stroke oil ??? I think I would run out of fingers and toes.

Cheers,
BB.

I accidentally ran one of my Powertorque mowers on straight petrol. I only found out when the mirror seized up mid now.
After replacing the fuel, it started up as normal and has worked fine since.
Might have a few scored though!

Sorry, meant "motor seized mid mow."
And "might have a few scores though."
I'll have to preview posts from now on as this site gives you little chance to edit.

I cant understand why people have trouble mixing 2 stroke petrol. I buy a jerry can of petrol and mix it into 2 five litre cans with the right amount of two stroke oil. It even tells you how much oil to use on the side of the can! Its not that hard!

People still have to mess around with oil with a Briggs because they use oil, but many people don't check it till they stop running and wonder why it stopped

Many people out there are inattentive and aren't conscientious with these things.
Now that two strokes have been in the minority of new Victa mower purchases for a long time, we have collectively lost the once common routine of mixing our own two stroke fuel.
Losing the 25:1 two stroke fuel bowsers hasn't helped.
One such pump at an independent petrol station in Sydney's south has had an out of use sign for many months.

Those were the days !!!

A "BP ZOOM" Pump at each BP site. Gee didn't Victa invest lots of money in their association with that petroleum giant.

Cheers,
BB.