OutdoorKing Repair Forum Forums Restoring, Customising and Modifying Engines The Simplex Project

Hi everyone! I have recently been working on a project involving Simplex engines.
I would like to get as many Simplex engine codes as possible and try to find any similarities from them. I know that we will not be able to confirm that what we find is accurate but I think we might be able to learn more from these codes.

So far I only have 4 codes, pretty pitiful... but we have to start somewhere.
So far these are the codes I have from the not so Simple Simplex:

Stationary Simplex engine (similar to those on mowers but crank is difference, pulley difference, barrel and head one piece instead of 2)
- Upper case is R6
- Lower case is 698

Buz-A-Cut Mower
- Upper case is VM
- Lower case is 668
This is were it gets strange...

Pace 1S85 mower
- Upper case says nothing...
- Lower case is V8312

Rover Major (this is where it gets more normal)
- Upper case is VB
- Lower case is 2318

I am guessing the Buz-A-Cut and stationary engine are from early-mid 1956 which explains the lower numbers, and the Rover Major is late 1957, which is why the engine number jumps up to the 2000s. What I don't understand is why the Pace is so much different, why is it in the 8000s and why is there a V infront of the number? and why is there nothing on the upper crankcase? I would love to see more Pace mowers with Simplex engines to see if they are the same.

If you have a Simplex engine I would love to know the engine numbers and if possible a picture of the mower or engine. Hopefully I will be able to find some sort of pattern.

Thanks everyone! Hopefully we can learn some more about these engines.

Buz-A-Cut and Rover were both from Queensland, both start with V, perhaps V is a Queensland code?? Will need more engine codes.

Jack do you have any info on factories that the Simplex was made?

Hi Kye

To my knowledge, all Hardman & Hall engines were made at Newtown, Sydney.
The address is on the manual here:-
https://www.outdoorking-forum.com.au/forum/ubbthreads.php?ubb=showflat&Number=72392

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Jack

I have downloaded the manual, hopefully it will help.
I have seen a few Simplex engines online that have tags on them, which say what brand made them, I forgot what one said but it was made by a place that makes toilets.

Cheers Jack! Its much appreciated.

Might be some traps there; there were a few companies that sold stationary engines with 'Simplex' in the name. 'Baltic Simplex' is fairly common, sold by the Baltic Simplex Machinery Co. Many [maybe all] of their engines were rebrands from local manufacturers, e.g. Ronaldson Tippett and Rosebery/Buzacott.

Hardman & Hall became 'Gearco Engineering' at some point, and still manufacture and support the Simplex marine engine line. They are now located in Seven Hills, NSW.
See HERE .

I am just looking at the Simplex 85cc engine that they use on mowers like the Rover, Pace and Minter. Like the one in the link above.

I have just been given a code to a Minter lawn mower, I think it was V8584, similar to the Pace, but I need him to tell me to make sure, it could be V8 584 similar to the stationary 85cc I got recently.

Hi Kye and Gadge

Yep, Gadge is quite right in the researching of the name 'Simplex'.
It was used on American and British machinery. For example, I have a
J.P. Simplex (in pieces).

I note that the manual refers to the 85cc as both a Mark 3 and
an 'LM' engine. I guess 'LM' probably stands for 'lawn mower'.
The 'V' might simply refer to a vertical shaft configuration.

Perhaps Gearco might know - or refer you to - someone in the know.
It's worth a try...

-----------------------
Jack

I have seen the J.P. Simplex mowers around the place, Buzacotts sold them.

I think you might be on the money with 'V' for Vertical, all the Simplex's I have seen for Lawn mowers have started with the V, just 2 were VM or VB on upper case and numbers on lower, and the others were V then a number straight after, all on the lower case. Its also interesting that both the V---- engines were in the 8000s

The one that was positioned horizontally had "R" instead of V, the crank was the same as the "Model 2" but the barrel was one piece alloy or aluminium.

I might have to try to make contact with Gearco soon to try and find it, hopefully I don't end up speaking to a robot...

Thanks everyone!

The owner of the Minter has confirmed that it is V8584, so V---- was not unique to Pace Simplex engines.

Jack do you think Rover would have been as big as Pace and Minter around this time?

We just got another Pace 1S85 today, the code was upper VM lower 212, completely different to the other one.
It is VM like the one on the Buz-A-Cut, only 456 numbers apart. Time to see if there is any diference between the one on the Rover and the Pace/Buz-A-Cut.

Hi Kye

I guess your project is revealing some data then.
Your Buzz-A-Cut must date from about the same year as the Pace -
as expected, I guess ...

Clearly, we need more data, but your project has already revealed
some good information.

p.s. 'Simplex' is a clever name in that it seems to combine both
'simple' and 'complex'. I guess many simple ideas are complex in
their execution.

-----------------------
Jack

Sounds about right, the Rover would have to be 1957 wouldn't it?

Hopefully more members will send in there codes for us Jack.

Its a great name! I really did like the sound of it when I first heard about them. Hopefully these codes will be on the simple side and not the complex.

Thanks Jack!

Alright, time to reboot this project!

Here is the list,

VM / 212 1956 Pace

VB / 2318 1957 Rover Major

R6 / 698 Stationary engine

(Lower only) V8312 1956-57 Pace

VM / 668 Buz-a-cut

(lower only) V8584 Minter

(lower only) V3922 Buzacott stationary

(lower only) V3963 Buzacott stationary

So VM is most likely 1956 (still got to confirm with more numbers) Which would made the Buz-a-cut 1956, which is what I expected. The rest is a little strange, but we will work it out.

Thanks everyone!

Many thanks Kye

It is only through slow, meticulous research that some view
may be reasonably formed.

I do feel that more data is needed here - to form an opinion.
But nothing prevents speculation.

Thanks for taking the initiative in this most esoteric of
subjects. It is well worthwhile in understanding the past.

--------------------
Jack

I got another number today, a Minter, V9306. Ads from 1955 show a Minter with a Simplex, which means that the Simplex was being made in 1955.
I strongly doubt the lower V---- would be 1955, it seams to early, but I will keep open minded until I have more numbers.

My internet is out after yetsurdays storm so my posts and responses to messages will be slow, sorry everyone

G'day Kye

Many thanks.
It may take some time to reap rewards from this info.
I feel what these alpha-numerics show is that ... there is some
sort of system going on!

Hopefully, more simplex than complex.
----------------------
Jack

Alright, we have another code now, V9640 and from a Rover Cadet, i'm guessing 1957.
Perhaps VM is 1956, V---- is 1957.

Hi Kye

I'm not familiar with a 'Cadet'
Any photos?

-----------------------
Jack

I will message you some pictures Jack, its just like mine but it says Cadet instead of Major

Many thanks Kye: received.

The Cadet does need recording as an early Rover.
It is the younger sister or brother to the Rover Major.

For an unexplained reason, Australia experimented with the off-set
wheel design for rotaries in about 1957-58. The market rejected it.
Perhaps that is the reason ... experiment / reject.

All very out-of-square.
----------------------------
Jack