Like me you might be hanging out for Summer to come to an end so the bloody Kikuyu will slow down growing.
My recently put into service Deutcher H660 has been working well - but I noticed yesterday that it seems to have a slow gearbox leak from the left rear wheel (from the aspect of the user). Noticed before using it a slight dribble of fluid on the tyre, so checked the gearbox level, which appeared down a tad, I've been filling up to the entry hole level (until it starts spilling out whilst keeping the mower flat) - topped back up before use.
After use I wondered if it was a leak or just because I'd tipped it in the past - so placed a small container under the joint after use and in the mornign there was 10ml or so of fluid in it.
No leakage at all from the other wheel, mower has not been tipped at all between uses or for several weeks.
Wondering the best way to approach dealing with this? The leak is not coing from the gearbox itself - but rather where the rear wheel's axle enters into the 'green painted frame'. Can get a pic if it will assist.
Hi Nick, I feel your pain, I had to replace the seals on a G22 and I am still waiting on the seals to arrive from China, my usual supplier doesn't list them or even close. I had a hell of a time getting the wheels off to get to the seals. I don't know how many seals they fitted but when I removed the seal there was another one behind it, not sure but there might be another one behind that as well. I'm just replacing the outer one when they arrive. I have had the wheels off a Y560 and they were hard to remove but I had that gearbox out on the bench and I was able to punch them out with a brass drift but it was hard going. I didn't bother checking how many seals were fitted to that one
Hmmmm it's a very slow leak - I wonder if there is a 'bodge' solution I can utilise instead of pulling it apart? Some kind of additive that will 'plug ' the leak or some thing I can apply from the outside to somewhat stem the flow - even though it appear very low as is.
I don't think I've got the skillset to manage pulling that apart - if it's a handful for Norm, let alone locating where to get the seals from etc.
Reading up this morning - the Lucas stuff has a decent rep for stopping leaks in transmissions & gearboxes - just use a small amount and add more if needed (seems folks get issues as there is no set amount to use and they overdo it). Seems it has solvents that cause the rubber seals to soften and swell.
There's other similar products that seem to work on same basis.
Alternatively a lot seem to endorse instead using a grease gun to add a very soft grease, which will sometimes block the leak &/or replace the 95W-140 for all intents and purposes.
Welcome feedback, is a shame it's hard to gauge the fluid level in the gearbox, you can really only look at what leaks (I keep a small container underneath and it's very little or top back up until it overflows.
PS. One of the products that seems to come up a lot with leaking gearboxes is JD Corn Head grease.....apparently it's a 0 grade grease but it's thick when stable but thins when aggitated. For this reason it seems to work well in gearboxes with leaks as when its not in use it won't come out and when the gearbox runs it lubricates it very well.
Indian built Enfield gearboxes used 00 grease for years because they couldn't work out how to make seals for them to keep the oil in them. The English Enfields used oil in the same gearbox and with proper seals the Indian boxes could be made oil tight
Penrite specify it for gearboxes and also for ones that leak, if nothing else I figure it will stem the flow of gear oil, can't imagine it would do any worse than gear oil as isn't an overly intensive usage in a deutscher's gearbox. Seems a low risk way to solve an issue that would be an utter PITA changing the seals.
The stop leak additives don't work if the seal is worn out or cracked.
Using grease instead of oil in a transaxle isn't usually recommended.
Gear oil is designed to flow freely and provide lubrication over a wide range of temperatures and operating conditions. It also contains additives that help protect gears and reduce wear. Steering box grease is thicker and does not flow as freely, which can lead to inadequate lubrication.
Gear oil has better heat dissipation properties compared to grease. Grease can trap heat within the gearbox, potentially leading to overheating and failure of components over time.
Gearboxes are designed to work with lubricants that minimize friction and allow parts to move smoothly. Grease can hinder the movement of gears, potentially causing them to bind or operate less efficiently.
Manufacturers specify particular lubricants for a reason—typically based on extensive testing to ensure optimal performance and longevity of the equipment. Deviating from these recommendations could lead to mechanical problems.
Grease is often used in steering boxes because they typically involve slower-moving parts and operate under different conditions than high-speed gearboxes.
Steering mechanisms generally involve slower, more controlled movement, which allows grease to provide effective lubrication without the need for the free-flowing properties of oil.
For longevity it's recommended to replace the oil seal . If you took the transaxle out and gave it to a repairer to remove the wheels and change the seal it may not be that expensive .
Hi Nick, The wheels are all different, the G I spent hours getting the wheels of are different to the Y22 that I had the wheel off because I had to split the cases so I could replace the "O" ring on the gear selector shaft. That one I had the box out and I hammered on the end of the shaft with a brass drift and eventually got it off. I did replace the gearbox housing on an R36 rideon but it was some years ago and I can't remember how I got those wheels off but because I can't remember they must have come off without too much trouble. I tried the local bearing place for the seals but they didn't list anything close so I typed into ebay the size I wanted and just went through till I found the size I wanted. Because I was looking for seals for a G built in the early sixties they were obviously an imperial seal so I had to go for the closest metric one I could find
Mate no worries at all - I can manage without it, just have to remember where I end up scalping the property on undulating spots. So look see how you go but if you don't manage to get it done its no issue - the sun will still come up for me, no harm done at all. I know your services are in demand. :-)
Well I got the wheel off the H660. I either got lucky or your ones were lot tricker - only took one wheel off (on the problematic side) just undid the nut from the wheel side, placed a lift under the axle and a few taps of a rubber hammer got it to come away from the shaft/axle.
How would one proceed from here to replace the seal - assuming one was going to do so - don't tell me you have to hammer the shaft/axle out? If so I'll likely pass on it - but if it's not overly hard and the seal and be gotten out somehow I'm open minded to it.
I took the wheel off to try a big of a bodge effort - in reading up about similar issues one things folks advocate is using some brake fluid on the seals (whick they apply from INSIDE the gearbox) as they say this makes the rubber in the seals swell slightly and often fixes the leak.
The issue with that route being that brake fluid in your gearbox isn't a good thing.
So I thought I'd just use a syringe to with the axle angled upright (25-30 degrees I guess) I put a small amount of brake fluid in the seal area to hopefully permeate down onto the rubber part of it.
Unsure if it will do any good but figured it could not harm, which I wasn't sure about if one had put inside the gearbox (thought I suppose you could perform a flush to get rid of it but still). Also have the Penrite 00 grease, which I conceed isn't a perfect solution but I thought I would supplement the 85W-140 in it with a bit of the grease and monitor the leaks between usage. Imperfect product I know but it's an imperfect problem so I figure it's going to be better than the gearbox running low on fluid, whereas the grease will remain and is meant to be a good product thats not entirely unsuitable.
Hi Nick, You have to dig the seal out as you do with any seal, either use a seal removing tool or drill it and use a slide hammer with a self tapper in it
Hi Nick, You have to dig the seal out as you do with any seal, either use a seal removing tool or drill it and use a slide hammer with a self tapper in it
Hi Norm,
Ah well I am guessing looking into replacing the seal will be superior than using the grease etc - that doesn't sound so hard. Which type of shops would sell the appropriate replacement seal? From the Deutscher manual it appears it's a Seal, axle 7/8â€x1,3/8â€x1/4â€.
Would somewhere like Repco be the place to go? I'm in Coffs Harbour, NSW - have most major auto stores etc.
Sorry not something I've ever bought or noticed previously in my 50yrs. ;-)
Hi Nick, Any bearing place is your starting point but being an imperial size it can be a bit of a problem but see how you go Seeing this is a fairly later model I thought Deutscher would have moved on a bit and started fitting metric seals to them
Hi Nick, Any bearing place is your starting point but being an imperial size it can be a bit of a problem but see how you go Seeing this is a fairly later model I thought Deutscher would have moved on a bit and started fitting metric seals to them
Hi Norm,
Located what might be a suitable seal at the local bearing place - so are they described as an 'axle seal' or is there a more specific description needed to ensure you get the right one?
The local bearing place said they were ~$6 each, which makes me wonder if it's the correct item?
Seems there's rotary shaft seals, single lip seals, double lip seals etc - who knew - not sure how best to explain so I don't come home with the wrong bit of kit.
PS. Just to make sure I know what I'm planning on doing, Norm you were kind enough to state how to remove the axle seals earlier (much thanks) but am I correct in assuming I should be able to remove the old seals without any special gear? I don't have a slide hammer or seal removal tool - is it still doable without either of those?
Does the axle itself need to be removed or can I drill into the seal, insert a screw or similar to allow me to pull it out - then press the new one in? I'm just guessing - never have done before or even looked inside one.
Hi Nick, any seal that will fit will do, not like the axle is rotating at any speed, maybe double if if you can get it in the size. As for getting them out you might be able to get them out with a screwdriver, in through the seal part and lever it out. Some come out easily others can be a bit more difficult. Try to minimize the damage to it because they may need to get the right size by measuring it up. $6 sounds about right for a seal that size
Much thanks for the reply and explanation - is always appreciated and never taken for granted. :-)
Will grab a seal and replace - I'd bought that semi-fluid grease as well but loathe to put in if I could stop the leak, drained the gearbox this morning - was a tad surprised to find it only had around 450ml of fluid in it, as I'd only recently filled it up to the brim and it's meant to take 750ml.
Little surprising as I've been keeping a container under the seal between uses and the leak has been rather slow BUT I suspect that when in use the leak is worse, so likely dropping more fluid then.
